PDA

View Full Version : TyTool6, VOB AND DVD extras...



jdiner
03-12-2003, 12:08 AM
Alright. A new thread. This one is to replace the existing TyTool #5 thread. Specifically it is going to be about the DVD tools and ways to do this better.

The same rules apply. Be Nice, Be Sweet to each other, at the very least Be Courteous or get out and stay out. As mentioned before I am going to police this thread and anything that is a "problem" post is gone. Don't like it, post your comments elsewhere.

Alright. So let's get on with it.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-12-2003, 12:29 AM
Alright. As promised here are my comments on what I did to get a multi-show DVD with perfect sync through out.

I used all my own stuff with one, simple and yet major exception... :)

I am trying to make that clear because I don't want to keep rehashing the same thing over and over and over. Again everything here is assumed to be mine unless clearly marked otherwise. So here we go... the details:

1- I enhanced the mux'er in Vsplit/TyTool to produce the appropriate pair of packets for the VOB structure, rather than the current MPEG-2 structure. Current these packets are created with the correct header but are completely empty content wise.

So what is produced is an MPEG program stream in VOB format that is not yet valid. Sounds bad right? But bear with me this was done on purpose.

So bottom line what this means at this point is that we have something that never needs to be remux'ed. It is "done" in terms of byte alignments and other related issues.

2- I enhanced the mux'er further to produce seperate files. 1 for each segment between the cuts. So if you cut, lead-in, and 2 sets of commercials in the middle, and lead-out on a show like this:

*cut-LeadIn* seg *cut-Com1* seg *cut-Com1* seg *cut-LeadOut*

You will get 3 output mpeg files. Each stored away with a nice brand new shiny name to seperate them and make it clear what they were.

3- I then added support, in the right way, for a fixed up version of ifogen and tocgen.

These program are open source code for the filling in of the blank/empty VOB packets produced now in step #1.

A nice new GUI element was added to support the process. You can tell where it was going from before but I will try to explain the process again at the end of this message.

But here the empty-vob segments that have been created by the above steps are turned into a single "file set". A bunch of vobs and the ifo/bup files to create a complete vob.

Now I take no credit at all for the ifogen/tocgen programs. All I did was port them to win32, clean up some things that were just a little short sighted, make then a library, and streamline the calling mechanism with a GUI.

But basically each segment from above becomes a chapter. Making for reasonable navigation etc...

There is no menu support in this, sorry. I know nowhere near enough to get menu support going. Not going to either. :) Surely we can search and find some tools (ifoedit?) that can load and deal with vobs to add extra things like that?!!?

4- Burned it out as a UDF1.02 format on my DVD-RW drive and plopped it into my Apex. Worked like a champ.

However the 1.05 format failed to even register as a disk. Not sure what the most compatible formats really are.


So the process will be:
- Download the TyStream file.
- Make the key file.
- Cut the commercials unwanted bits.
- Mux the file(s) to a vob.
- Pick the selected shows for the disk image and process to a "file set". (What is the right term for that set of files anyway? :)
- Load the DVD creation tool (nero or some other), pick the directory created by the tool, and burn.

That is the long and short of it.

Again that is going to leave you without menu's for those that love that kind of thing. But the great news is that I have run a number of tests and audio-video sync don't drift for me.

Now this is not a clean up to the point where those suffering current audio distress will be happy. This is not about DD5.1 or whatever. It is about taking the mainstream of what works now to the next stage. I will be coming back to the rest of it when the time is right.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-12-2003, 12:32 AM
Now some of you might ask when does this ambrosia ship. Where can you get it?

At the moment nowhere. Thanks to the open source wrangling that has gone on here I am being slowed by it a bit. I am working over the ifo/toc-gen sources right now and I need to get them to where I like them and to make sure that nothing has violated anyones rights. I am going to have to make sure that everything is completely sterile to try and stop any more fights.

So for now there are no beta testers for this. I am the only one with a copy and it will stay that way for a bit longer. When the release is really I will be posting the changes and source to ifo/toc-gen as require by the liscence and binary versions of my own programs.

Sorry. But after the constant wrangling here it is the only reasonable approach to take.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-12-2003, 12:34 AM
Further I opened a dialog with olaf_sc about the menus and chapters of a DVD and the facilities of the ifo/toc-gen tools.

He indicated an interest in helping with the furthering of these tools as he seems to know a great deal about the format and what would need to be done. But he also said that he is busy with his own tools and was uncertain of his time commitments.

Hopefully when we get to that point the masses here can convince him to get involved reguardless of the problems he and I have had in the past over our points of view.

Just something to keep in mind.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-12-2003, 12:42 AM
Oh and I asked this before but I would love to get some more information. Is there a compatible format that plays in every player? Or at least most players. I found a small window that works for my DVD player... But it took a while and a number of bad burns.

In my case all that was needed to change to get it work was the UDF format. But then I took the disk to the local Circuit City and tried it there and found that it works in some players, seemed to be the older ones, but the latest Sony's and JVC's failed on the disk. But the 1.05 version, at least I think that was what Nero was creating, worked just fine...

Which is very frustrating. For those that are creating disks to pass around or at least to get the most playability on the most platforms I would love to hear from so you so that we can get this all tuned to work in the most possible cases.

--jdiner

BubbleLamp
03-12-2003, 12:57 AM
Well I can only speak for myself, but I was hoping for fully functional MPEGs coming out of the GOPEditor before you even wrangled with authoring tools. Reason being, there are tons of authoring tools already, but the well hashed/bashed audio and temporal errors prevent vplit generated files from working with them cleanly.

Just my .02 cents.

Pr.Sinister
03-12-2003, 01:00 AM
I see you finally decided to make separate files for each segment
between cuts! It's about time! j/k!

For us anal types that MUST have nice menus, it's gonna make it
a cinch to make chapters/menus this way...providing it can create
program streams that way and not just VOBs... anyway...

Compatibilty with players :

I have found, like you, that different UDF versions play in different
players. But what i have the most success with is in Nero, using
DVD-ROM (UDF/ISO) and forcing Xbox compatibilty. This results in
a DVD that plays in My Apex, Pioneer, Xbox and PS2. It also plays
great in my friend's Toshiba. So maybe i should make one of those
and go to Future Shop and try it in a whole bunch of DVD players
and post my results.

-Pr.

snoopy
03-12-2003, 01:11 AM
So the process will be:
- Download the TyStream file.
- Make the key file.
- Cut the commercials unwanted bits.
- Mux the file(s) to a vob.
- Pick the selected shows for the disk image and process to a "file set". (What is the right term for that set of files anyway? :)
- Load the DVD creation tool (nero or some other), pick the directory created by the tool, and burn.

I was thinking something like:
-Download the TYStream in VOB MUX mode.
-Pick the selected shows (VOB files) and pocess to a file set
(which contains VOB, BUP, IFO files).
-Put files in VIDEO_TS folder automaticaly created by Nero (or burner of your choice)
-Burn DVD

Is this a possible senario for those that don't care about commercials or am I way off base?

Thanks again jdiner for such wonderfull work!

jdiner
03-12-2003, 03:22 AM
Ummm. Yeah that is possible. There is no "need" to edit. But that is what most people want to do. It costs nothing to not edit. You just get it all...

Oh and the creation of the video_ts directory and the rest of the setup is automatic and part of the tool. The whole point in a GUI is to make this as simple as possible.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-12-2003, 03:27 AM
Originally posted by BubbleLamp
Well I can only speak for myself, but I was hoping for fully functional MPEGs coming out of the GOPEditor before you even wrangled with authoring tools. Reason being, there are tons of authoring tools already, but the well hashed/bashed audio and temporal errors prevent vplit generated files from working with them cleanly.

Just my .02 cents.
Unless you know something that I don't at this point. The problem is in the remux stage. Always has been. And if it comes out as a program stream. It has to be remux'ed. I mean it. It has to be. You have to have the VOB slots in it for it to be part of a file set.

But I am not adverse to spending a bit of time trying to figure out what is going on with the rest of it. I guess I will have to hop on over to the thread from Pr.S and see what is being done and what fails. Does anyone have a small segment, TyFileSplit type thing, that show cases an audio failure?

The reason I went to VOBs and what not is because in doing so I can garantee the file is correct. I have tests litterally hundreds of clips now, not burned just tested, and sync was maintain in all of them. Plus the edited spots worked both ways, as an all in 1 and as a bunch of seperate files...

I don't mind stopping if another tool really works. Especially one that gives menus. But at last report it was pretty hit and miss.

--jdiner

dlang
03-12-2003, 03:40 AM
when you release this will it be windows only or will there be some way for the rest of us to use it? I don't even mind (much:)) if the rest of us can't use the graphical editor to create the cut file as long as the rest of it will work.

David Lang

bato
03-12-2003, 03:55 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
I guess I will have to hop on over to the thread from Pr.S and see what is being done and what fails. Does anyone have a small segment, TyFileSplit type thing, that show cases an audio failure?
I have 2 small segments, one cut from the muxed mpg file prior to the MF2 process and then the same after converted to VOB by MF2. First one is 7MB second is 12MB, the diff is the audio that keeps going even when the video stops. Where do you want me to put them?

jdiner
03-12-2003, 04:06 AM
I need the TyStream files. I need to run the process the whole way to see what is happening at each stage.

Is the mpeg being made right? Is it the mux stage? Is it something to do with the cutting? etc...

--jdiner

bato
03-12-2003, 04:16 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
I need the TyStream files. I need to run the process the whole way to see what is happening at each stage.

Is the mpeg being made right? Is it the mux stage? Is it something to do with the cutting? etc...

--jdiner
From the Pr.S thread:
- ty file process is ok
- vsplit key generation is ok
- gopeditor cut points ok
- vsplit mux generation is ok
- resulting muxed mpg without cuts ok

then when we use that perfect playing (in PowerDVD) mpg file and import into MovieFactory2 for process the resulting VOB keep sync in the first part until the cut, then the video stops and the audio keep going for the lenght of the cut, then video start playing again with audio out of sync and then again the same in next cut so the audio stop playing long before video.

As I stated in other post, maybe I don't explain things right, if you take a look at the files you will understand.

In short, the resulting muxed file from your tools keeps perfect sync, the problem only happen when that file is converted to VOB with MovieFactory2 or DVDWorkshop without the simple multiplex step in TMPGEnc. I don't know if you can do something about it, your mpg plays ok.

We know you are working in other things, and we can make the mpgs work with another step, no need to work in this right now.

newbie
03-12-2003, 09:40 AM
Josh--Many of the older DVD players won't handle any burned DVD's.

This link gives you some ideas as to what players work.

http://www.dvdrhelp.com/dvdplayers

The Apex units seem to be able to handle almost anything.

I read that 1.02 is supposed to be more compatable. I know when I use IFOEDIT I exit, open the vob and "get VTS sectors".

I appreciate the work of you (and others) in helping us with our "hobby".

Pr.Sinister
03-12-2003, 09:54 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
I need the TyStream files. I need to run the process the whole way to see what is happening at each stage.

Is the mpeg being made right? Is it the mux stage? Is it something to do with the cutting? etc...

--jdiner

Actually it will happen with ANY TyStream. All you have to do is
follow the steps i layed out in the 1st post of the DVD MovieFactory
thread. If you skip step step 7, you will have a problem after the
title set is created. It will play perfect until you arrive at the point
where the 1st cut has been made. The video will freeze and the
audio will continue. If the segment you cut out was 2min 37secs,
the video will stay frozen for that amount of time. When the video
restarts, it is obviously waaaayyy out of sync.

Maybe the MPEG is missing info needed by DVD Workshop to
generate the proper NAV packets... but then again, i don't know
anything about MPEG and VOB structures so... :D

Anyway what i suggest before you try the process yourself is
maybe just mux an MPEG with cuts in the middle, then go directly
to step 7 (Simple Mux in TMPGEnc) and diff the 2 files. Maybe
you'll just see something and say "DOH!" ;) That might save time.

-Pr.

bato
03-12-2003, 10:26 AM
I knew someone would explain it better :D . Thanks Pr.Sinister.

Still, if you want to see the problem in "action" I have 2 files total less than 20MB, cut in same video position just in the first cut, so you can see the problem.

BubbleLamp
03-12-2003, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
Unless you know something that I don't at this point. The problem is in the remux stage. Always has been. And if it comes out as a program stream. It has to be remux'ed. I mean it. It has to be. You have to have the VOB slots in it for it to be part of a file set.

But I am not adverse to spending a bit of time trying to figure out what is going on with the rest of it. I guess I will have to hop on over to the thread from Pr.S and see what is being done and what fails. Does anyone have a small segment, TyFileSplit type thing, that show cases an audio failure?

The reason I went to VOBs and what not is because in doing so I can garantee the file is correct. I have tests litterally hundreds of clips now, not burned just tested, and sync was maintain in all of them. Plus the edited spots worked both ways, as an all in 1 and as a bunch of seperate files...

I don't mind stopping if another tool really works. Especially one that gives menus. But at last report it was pretty hit and miss.

--jdiner

Yes, I meant fixing the output of the remux'd files, sorry for the confusion. But the point is the same, instead of having to create more tools to handle the problematic resultant MPEGs, it seems resolving what's wrong with the MPEG as it now comes from vsplitmux would be optimal. No need for special purpose tools. You'd be free to create whatever toolset suits your fancy without all of us begging for this or that, because we'd have alternatives in the mean time.

Fugg
03-12-2003, 12:28 PM
I have had the greatest success using vsplitmux2c and tydemux 0.4.2 to get the elementals. I have found that if I run across a ty that one can't handle, the other one will do it. I have not found one yet I could not make work. (I've even had someone send me a series2 ty that was hosed up pretty bad and made it sing pretty!!) On the occasion that I have a ty that's been hosed by a signal strength problem or glitch, I simply "jump" around the bad block while converting the ty to elementals.

I use either mplex or simple mux in tmpgenc plus 2.5(ver. 2.54.37.135) to get a good, muxed mpeg file. I use tmpgenc's simple mux when the ty is over 2gig, as the second file from mplex is reported in dvdpatcher as "No Sequence Header Found".

I then use tmpgenc's merge and cut to slice out the commercials. I've tried womble's mpeg2vcr to do the edits, but it adds a "Temporal Reference Error" at every cut point, as reported by spruceup when importing. I get the same error when trying to use a file edited with gopeditor.

If the ty is from my dtivo, I patch the first header in the mpg to 720x480, 3.5mbps using dvdpatcher (ver1.05b/4.05.2002). If the ty is from my sa (352x480 w/audio converted to 48k), it imports into spruceup directly.

I then import the edited mpeg into spruceup(full ver. 1.1, build 1106) and allow it to crash after creating support files.

I then repatch the headers back to 480x480, but I leave the bitrate at 3.5m.

I start spruceup again, import the files again(this time it doesn't crash), add chapter points, create menus, create a title set and burn using a udf format.

I have a pioneer a04 using memorex, sony and tdk -r and -rw media, burning with the software that came with the a04.(Veritas' RecordNowDX ver.4.11, build 400B71a.332(PAU)) It can only burn with one UDF format (and I don't even know what that one is!) so there is no other choice with my burning setup.

watching on an apex1100w(-r and -rw) and an apex3501(-r only).

Very clean and easy.

I have (and I'm knocking on wood here) 100% success doing it this way. It stays in sync end to end.

When I make dvd's from my dtivo, some players can't handle the 480x480 video.

When I make dvd's from my sa @ 352x480, 48khz audio,(true 1/2D1) EVERY PLAYER I HAVE TRIED IT ON WORKS. Old or new, rich or poor.

My burning question is:

Am I simply blessed by the ty fairies or am I on to something here?
:confused:

Sorry if this post sounds weird in the context of this thread, but I thought it was worth it due to the thought of jdiner doing all kinds of codeing to try to get to the point where I seem to be at now with his current tools.

I'm by no means an expert, nor do I play one on tv.
;)

bato
03-12-2003, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by jdiner
I don't mind stopping if another tool really works. Especially one that gives menus. But at last report it was pretty hit and miss.
AFAIK from what I read in the thread Pr.Sinister started and my tests, we always have a hit when we author DVDs with menus with MovieFactory2 and DVDWorkshop.

Pr.Sinister, even edited the first post with step by step what is needed to do to make it work right every time.

At this time what is needed is:
- your tools (tytool, vsplitmux, gopeditor)
- DVDPatcher 1.05B
- TMPGEnc
- MovieFactory2 or DVDWorkshop

Maybe you can do something about the need for TMPGEnc and make it useless (and I know Pr.Sinister will edit the howto), I know it is not one of your goals, no pressure there, we have this guide and works every time, great looking DVDs with menus (even submenus, motion menus, etc.) with perfect sync everytime.

bato
03-12-2003, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by Fugg
My burning question is:

Am I simply blessed by the ty fairies or am I on to something here?
:confused:

Sorry if this post sounds weird in the context of this thread, but I thought it was worth it due to the thought of jdiner doing all kinds of codeing to try to get to the point where I seem to be at now with his current tools.

I'm by no means an expert, nor do I play one on tv.
;)
Yep, that's another way to do it. If you want a third (your way, Pr.Sinister step by step), you can use DVDMaestro to edit your video (I did this and it works, but it is time consuming, I better use Pr.Sinister guide), you only need:
- m2v and m2a
- patch m2v and import in DVDMaestro
- if no GOP errors goto m2a to ac3
- if GOP errors, try tydemux and it will fix it
- m2a to ac3
- trim start/end video in Maestro, if you have 4 cuts then you will have to add the video 3 times and trim at the parts you want to keep
- Create Sync Audio Track
- Create menu with DVD Menu Studio
- Compile and Burn

The pros is that you will have more control in the resulting product, chapters do match (some report wierd things with DVDWorkshop), is faster in many aspects than MF2 and DVDWS, you can create files bigger than 4.38GB and then compress them with DVD2one to make it fit (when your 2 movies are just a little bit bigger, say 4.9GB), you can have multiple audio tracks, etc.

laserfan
03-12-2003, 01:10 PM
Originally posted by Fugg
I have had the greatest success using vsplitmux2c and tydemux 0.4.2 to get the elementals...When I make dvd's from my sa @ 352x480, 48khz audio,(true 1/2D1) EVERY PLAYER I HAVE TRIED IT ON WORKS. Old or new, rich or poor....Fugg pls advise the steps you take, and specifically:

1. Where in your process you adjust the audio offset?

2. When and with what tool do you upsample the audio?

TIA from another SA user who captures at 352x480!

Fugg
03-12-2003, 01:49 PM
"1. Where in your process you adjust the audio offset?"

On the mplex command line. Although, unless there's a problem with the ty, sync has not been an issue for me for many months now, even if I don't put in any value to offset.

"2. When and with what tool do you upsample the audio?"

I convert the mpa file to 48k before muxing using Mpeg2vcr's audio editor. It's a one step process with no quality problems.

and btw,

Every audio sync problem I've found has been tied to a hole or glitch in the ty. In that case, once I find out where the problem chunk is, I jump around it and the resultant mpeg keeps sync with no problems.

Stephen
03-12-2003, 02:50 PM
Anyone care to post the most recent copy of the tools at the start of the thread? Ive looked through the last 10 pages or so of the last thread that this replaced

jdiner
03-12-2003, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by Stephen
Anyone care to post the most recent copy of the tools at the start of the thread? Ive looked through the last 10 pages or so of the last thread that this replaced
Go to the sticky thread at the top this forum. They are always release there. Not in the threads themselves.

--jdiner

Stephen
03-12-2003, 05:27 PM
DUD.. Now I see said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.... I was thinking that a thread on the topic would include the tools on the topic... silly me :) Oh well each day that you dont learn something new is a wasted day

snoopy
03-12-2003, 11:38 PM
Originally posted by Stephen
DUD.. Now I see said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.... I was thinking that a thread on the topic would include the tools on the topic... silly me :) Oh well each day that you dont learn something new is a wasted day

Hang in there Stephen. Most of the folks in here are very nice if you follow the rules. Some of them will string you up by your neck if you don't. All and all, you can expect to get good information from dealdatabase.com

jdiner
03-13-2003, 03:51 AM
Ok. I have been thinking today about the benefits or parhaps more correctly the pros and cons of trying to use existing tools versus my own stuff.

First off let me try to explain something about the problems we are all seeing. Some are, I expect, my fault. Something I am doing wrong. Something I am not filling in quite right. But many including the most crucial ones are given to us directly by DTV.

The largest of these being the whole frame rate issue. In the end the stream is perfectly legal. Olaf clued in on what it was and after looking into it myself he was right.

But the mux'er out there that I can see all make the same assumptions and so mux the output wrong. This is why we can't just split and go to any tool and load the ES files.

So given that some of these issues might be fixable but some will not a reasonable game plan has to be found.

My approach, as pretty much always, is to write my own. I am darn near there.

The pros:
1- Almost ready to go, and I know it works.
2- The mux'ing is done fully aware of holes and timestamp issues. So sync is garanteed even if a hole occurs.

The cons:
1- It has to be beta tested and issues will probably be found.
2- It is based on other peoples software (ifogen) and as a result will only take us so far.
3- In my quick look at it menu's don't see to be part of ifoedit.
4- Menus are beyond me. In looking at a few things and talking to people there appears to be a scripting language that has to be used to create them and no freaking way basically. So we have to find an outside tool to do it.

All in all a short bit of work should have us making full disks with multiple shows and chapter support for skipping around.

The DVD Workshop Approach basically leaves me still writing code for other things. But uses someone elses "finished" tools.

The pros:
1- Almost ready to go, many here have had a good deal of succes with some notable failures. Especially around editing.
2- Much more complete toolset from what I have read. Support for menus, chapters, etc...

The cons:
1- Will it work in all cases? Who knows.
2- Will it work in at least a majority of cases? Who knows.
3- I have not yet tried it. Although I managed to get the right software today to try it out.
4- Will the known issues with the nature of the DTV/DTIVO/SATIVO streams work with the software?!!??
5- There are known audio issues that might not be easily resolved.
6- IT MUST REMUX. Which means that nothing with a hole in the data will work. Unless I supose they got truly smart with the mux'er which is easy to do right honestly, but no one seems to have. Might have I am not sure yet, but will check it out. (Since the editing has issues my best bet is they did not do it truly right... :(


Now the pros and cons are not intended to be a complete list. They are just the "to do" that I see in it all.

So I am open to comments and suggestions. I am willing at this point to work on either but not to work on both. But I would like something more direct in comments than "but that is what I wanted..." :)

--jdiner

snoopy
03-13-2003, 04:21 AM
Originally posted by jdiner

NOTE BY JDINER: Come on man. Edit for salient points in a post that long. Quoting an entire message that is that long is just not helpful...


I certainly opt for your approach vs a DVD Workshop approach. My reason for this is simple. ALOT of people are interested in menu's yes BUT, ALOT more people, including newbies are interested in an all in one solution that doesn't require additional sophisticated 3rd party software. Also many wanting menus don't realize that chapter stops will be available with "your approach" and so all is not a total loss. Newbies ask alot of questions and I think it would be most helpfull to the most number of people to have a solution out there that does it all with the exception of menu's. Maybe even package it with a Menu's.txt file that would keep people from repeatedly asking about it. I think "your approach" clearly solves the greatest number of problems for the greatest number of people, particulary newbies. Furthermore, I also agree with a comment from another member about including all the tools needed with each release. It solves all those annoying "where do I find the most current NowShowing.tcl" questions among others.

bronco13
03-13-2003, 04:37 AM
Josh,

I vote for your approach. I know that some people are interested in menus but consider this.

Any content we pull down from the TiVo is mainly for archiving. Let's face it I'm NOT going to pull down Star Wars, Minority Report, Spiderman, etc. Those are all movies that I'm going out and buying.

Bottom line: Anything worthy of a menu I'm going to purchase.

dlang
03-13-2003, 05:13 AM
depending to much on 3rd party tools runs into problems on some platforms. I see no problem useing something like ifogen that's readily available and able to be ported where it doesn't exist (as you did for windows) but I really don't want to be forced into putting up a windows machine becouse the only thing that does a decent enough job of dealing with the data is only available for windows :)

as for the menus, I think we will get there, but it will take more people working on it, and right now that's held up becouse the only way to get the VOB is useing tools that also do the menus (to some degree anyway) so people just use that and have no incentive to do menus any other way. once we can get the VOBs and start buring DVD's I think a lot of attention will focus on how to do menus

also I don't see menus being that nessasary for a recording of spiderman, but when I put 9 episodes of Good Eats on one DVD having a menu to pick the show I want would be handy :)

chris_tivo
03-13-2003, 08:20 AM
But not vital surely.

If you can put a chapter point for the start of each episode than a menu is not entirely vital. Obviously if you want chapter points within the episode its another issue.

From what jdiner has said he is onto a winner that I would expect a majority of the people on here will thank him many times over for.

With the stuff that Olaf is upto these are exciting times indeed.

Pr.Sinister
03-13-2003, 09:47 AM
Originally posted by bronco13
Josh,

I vote for your approach. I know that some people are interested in menus but consider this.

Any content we pull down from the TiVo is mainly for archiving. Let's face it I'm NOT going to pull down Star Wars, Minority Report, Spiderman, etc. Those are all movies that I'm going out and buying.

Bottom line: Anything worthy of a menu I'm going to purchase.

There are PLENTY of things worthy of a menu but that are not
available on DVD. And they either never will be or will be in 2 years.

snoopy : we do understand what chapters are and that there's
gonna be chapters. We like menus for direct access. If i have 11
30 minute shows and want to see the last one, i'd rather select
it than pressing next chapter 10 times. Also, some DVD Players
won't play DVD's without menus.

Either way, i don't care... My method works fine with Josh's tools
right now. I only have 1 extra step to do but it doesn't bother
me. And it doesn't bother anyone else that uses the DVD Worshop
method i don't think. Cause the end result is well worth it.

jdiner : I'm with you either way. Only thing that i would kindly ask
is that nice feature you put in to create a different file for each
segment between cuts. It would be great if we could enable and
disable it for Program Streams and not just VOB's. I have a very
strong feeling that just that will fix our Audio problem. It will be
just like if we have 1 cut in front and 1 cut after so it won't be
able to freeze at the cut points since there is nothing there.

-Pr.

RxMan
03-13-2003, 10:08 AM
Pr. Sinister hit it on the head as far as menus go.

If people are archiving 30min or 1hour shows, then a menu would be nice to access an individual show from the beginning.

Plus, a menu would actually show the name of each episode on the DVD.

bato
03-13-2003, 10:09 AM
I agree 100% with Pr.Sinister, we just using jdiner's tools, we don't want to pressure him in changing the way he works.

jdiner: we are using your tools right now and we thank you for that.

Some people want 1 tool for everything, I'm more the kind that uses the best tool for the particular process, no matter if I need 3 tools to acomplish that, and normaly I use 2 or 3 methods to doing that and use what I need for each case. Some people will want your tools to exctract, edit, create vobs and even burn directly to the burner, I can live with exctract and editing and then use another tool for vob creation and then another for burning.

So in other words, don't listen to me and keep the good work going :D

ronnythunder
03-13-2003, 11:37 AM
since we're all voting, here's my vote:

as long as i have chapter or title stops when i put multiple shows on a dvd, that's all i need. menus are nice, but i have no problem just putting the disc in and hitting "next" a few times to get what i want.

my priorities are, highest to lowest:

1. no resampling of audio or video. my dvd player does mpeg audio natively, and any solution that resamples the video or audio is a non-starter for me; i absolutely will not use anything that does this.
2. speed of conversion from ty -> dvd. less steps is better, more automation is better.
3. menus and pretty stuff. the other 2 are far more important, and i'd take it if available, but not necessary.

there's a reason that ifoedit is one of my favorite tools! :)

ronny

chadbear
03-13-2003, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by ronnythunder
2. speed of conversion from ty -> dvd. less steps is better, more automation is better.

Automation! I'm waiting on a reasonable way to get things from the ty to a disc writable format without having to attend to the process 5 times over the day. I just don't have spare time to do that... if there were an unattended way to just take tys and rip them straight to a DVd format, I'd pay good money for that and would buy the burner that day as well. I don't care a thing about menus or commercials or anything like that. I have a fast forward button and I'm not afraid to use it.

BubbleLamp
03-13-2003, 11:59 AM
I'm with Pr.S all the way. I just put 13 episodes on one disc, and I want a menu for them. If the sep files for each cut solves the audio, even better. (Though I'd still love to have working auto-detect for DD5.1)

Sorry Snoop, I don't fall into your "a lot more people" group.

Would I like it if I didn't have to fake the headers to get it into DVDWS, sure, but it's not a big deal.

Bottom line, if the cut-related audio problem goes away, many of us who want menus will probably be more than grateful.

2ride
03-13-2003, 02:38 PM
If no new tools ever come out I would still be VERY happy with what we have today.

A year ago we were happy to just be able to extract.

now we have the tools and know how to make kick ass dvd's of whatever the hell we want. Sure the DVDWS solution reqs a remux. no biggie.

we have come so far so fast that the rest is icing on the cake.


THANK GOD FOR DEALDATABASE
THANK GOD FOR JDINER

thanks to everyone who has made this sport the success that it is.

spinxter
03-13-2003, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by 2ride
thanks to everyone who has made this sport the success that it is.

Sport? What do you call it? Extreme TV Watching? :D

For anyone who cares, I simply want to be able to take a ty off the TiVo, cut the beginning and end, upsample the audio, and burn to DVD with no menu but maybe chapter breaks at places I select in the video. I also want dropouts in the source video signal to not crash the whole process.

Detail on the last item: I trade bootleg concert videos of Alice Cooper. These were made with camcorders. Ususlly by the time I get them on videotape they have been copied 5-30 times. Somewhere along the line someone's VCR might have eaten the tape momentarily, and the video goes to snow. TiVo doesn't record snow. It leaves a hole in the ty. Same thing happens if the person running the camcorder turned off the camera between the first set and the encore. There is usually about 2 seconds of blank tape there. TiVo chokes on blank tape.

A tool that would simply delete the holes (or just fill them with black screen) without corrupting the whole thing would be great.

Excellent work so far by everyone involved, by the way. So far I have no complaints. This may be a pain in the ass, but it's a whole lot cheaper than buying a set-top DVD recorder to dump my TiVo recordings to. :D :D :D

sky12
03-13-2003, 03:31 PM
I vote for JD's method as well.
I will be putting multiple episodes of a show on one DVD (Bubblegum crisis is the first going there)
and a menu would be nice, but one issue regarding DVD workshop is actually getting the software.
The 'simple' way is to spend $279US on a copy. (over $400 of our poor Cdn dollars)
I'm not sure we all have that much scratch laying about to get into the game.
I've been attempting alternate methods of getting the software, but haven't succeeded yet. (well, I got 1.0, but that doesn't seem to work with Sinister's methods well)

And some people will just be unwilling to play the winmx/kazaa game, don't have the cash and will be totally out of luck.

So, I say go with JD's method, then we can deal with menus later, either with tools like DVD workshop, or some openSource/JDinerSource solution. :)

Also, JD's method will be best for the Linux/Mac/Solaris folk out there.

Greg

snoopy
03-13-2003, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by sky12
I vote for JD's method as well.
I will be putting multiple episodes of a show on one DVD (Bubblegum crisis is the first going there)
and a menu would be nice, but one issue regarding DVD workshop is actually getting the software.
The 'simple' way is to spend $279US on a copy. (over $400 of our poor Cdn dollars)
I'm not sure we all have that much scratch laying about to get into the game.
I've been attempting alternate methods of getting the software, but haven't succeeded yet. (well, I got 1.0, but that doesn't seem to work with Sinister's methods well)

And some people will just be unwilling to play the winmx/kazaa game, don't have the cash and will be totally out of luck.

So, I say go with JD's method, then we can deal with menus later, either with tools like DVD workshop, or some openSource/JDinerSource solution. :)

Also, JD's method will be best for the Linux/Mac/Solaris folk out there.

Greg

Perhaps for a modest fee, we could work something out. I can get about anything that is out there.

captain_video
03-13-2003, 04:29 PM
Let's face it, there are lots of people in both camps (i.e. menus with vs. without). There are already methods that are tried and true to produce DVDs with menus, although they do not use the standard muxed output from Tytool6r3 but rather the raw m2v and m2a files obtained from splitting. This does require the use of SpruceUp or Maestro that some of you are trying to get away from but it is a proven method nonetheless. I'm sure there are enough whizkids in this forum that can whip up a way to use josh's final product with commercially available programs that can generate menus. I mean, hey - we can't let josh have all the fun, can we?

jdiner
03-13-2003, 04:38 PM
Alright. For now I am going to be working on the output from my mux'ing engine. I am not sure that all of the problems from the DTV source can be overcome. But with the success some are having it seemed like a good place to start. I am all for menu's as most of what I want is episodes of TV archived off. But for me they are not a necessity.

I think the price tag of the ULead tools will put it out of reach for many people. $279 for the ac-3 additions and $249 for mainstay. That is more than I paid for latest HDVR2.

So for now, I am just doing more of an investigation into the problems and the process. And if I can make if as flawless as possible then... sweet. I can start to burn things out en mass.

--jdiner

bato
03-13-2003, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by jdiner
I think the price tag of the ULead tools will put it out of reach for many people. $279 for the ac-3 additions and $249 for mainstay. That is more than I paid for latest HDVR2.

You're right about the price, MovieFactory costs $50, can't create the same kind of DVD but it costs less.

I'm waiting for DVDLab (http://www.mediachance.com/dvdlab/index.html) , it will cost $79 and I hope we can import the files just as we import in MF2/DVDWS, if not, maybe the author can make it work.

BubbleLamp
03-13-2003, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by snoopy
Perhaps for a modest fee, we could work something out. I can get about anything that is out there.

So can anyone with USENET. Let's not get greedy and try to make $$ off others on this board. Save that for A.D.H.

snoopy
03-13-2003, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by BubbleLamp
So can anyone with USENET. Let's not get greedy and try to make $$ off others on this board. Save that for A.D.H.

:)

jdiner
03-13-2003, 09:41 PM
Alright. The patch options of DVDPatcher are now a part of TyTool so that the use of the other tool is no longer needed.

No real need to add it. But I wanted to look at exactly what was being done just to try and make things a bit easier for people.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-13-2003, 10:26 PM
Hummm. Been trying to figure out how to make a menu in DVD Workshop that links to chapters in an attempt to figure this all out. So far no go, but I'll get there. Ah... Got it. Funny how it is the simple things....

So anyway, I got to thinking. How about having GopEditor have an option to save a key-frame as a jpg/bmp/whatever file to stick in the menu on the button?

Anyone here interested in such a feature?

--jdiner

BubbleLamp
03-13-2003, 11:03 PM
Originally posted by jdiner
Alright. The patch options of DVDPatcher are now a part of TyTool so that the use of the other tool is no longer needed.

No real need to add it. But I wanted to look at exactly what was being done just to try and make things a bit easier for people.

--jdiner

This might not be of much help if we'll still have to run TMPG to resolve the audio problems, since I believe (someone check me here) that the header patching needs to be done AFTER TMPG fixes the muxing errors.

Rotten
03-14-2003, 12:22 AM
That would be very sweet. As long as we have a way to make the chapter


Originally posted by jdiner
Hummm. Been trying to figure out how to make a menu in DVD Workshop that links to chapters in an attempt to figure this all out. So far no go, but I'll get there. Ah... Got it. Funny how it is the simple things....

So anyway, I got to thinking. How about having GopEditor have an option to save a key-frame as a jpg/bmp/whatever file to stick in the menu on the button?

Anyone here interested in such a feature?

--jdiner

jdiner
03-14-2003, 03:55 AM
Well. It took me longer than I wanted it too. But I figured out why the audio is getting off.

The mux'er in DVDWorkshop is better than most of the others I have seen. But it is still not doing things the best possible way.

I thought I had sync fixed but found out that I was wrong. The problem is that if you have a data->cut->data segment. Right now I am producing the PTS/DTS values so that things stay sync'ed and happy.

But the since the DVDWS program remux'es this is lost. They could keep it, much like I am doing now, but they don't. So reguardless of what they "could be doing" they aren't. So since the cuts do line up perfectly thanks to the video being the restriction you get off. Somewhere between 0 and 23.999 MS off in the audio playing to early at every cut during the DVDWS remux step.

So the only chance is the multiple output files approach. But even then the initial sync is still an issue as if it dumping that information then things are going to be a bit off from start to finish.

I am just now verifying what is going on with that.

--jdiner

jdiner
03-14-2003, 04:17 AM
Well. Those that guessed that doing it as completely seperate MPEGs were right. There is still something wrong with the transition as I got a couple of bad blocks a the cut over point but it was pretty small potatoes all things considered. Not sure what yet I can do about it. Will have to look at making the cutter a bit different.

The good news is that no tmpgenc demux/mux was needed to make it work. The audio stayed perfectly synced without issue from segment to segment to segment.

So a bit faster, but dvdpatcher is still needed. You have to go to and from with the current DVDWS process. So I pulled it back out of TyTool. Well sort of. What I am thinking now is put up a simple window, like the others, that will go "to" the standard to acceptable by DVDWS so that it can be done more easily on the new multiple files.

Coming back to 480x480 I will probably do as well because a disk can consist of 4 files and it is still easier to do them all at once etc...

Anyway, good news for the most part. :)

--jdiner

Pr.Sinister
03-14-2003, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
Hummm. Been trying to figure out how to make a menu in DVD Workshop that links to chapters in an attempt to figure this all out. So far no go, but I'll get there. Ah... Got it. Funny how it is the simple things....

So anyway, I got to thinking. How about having GopEditor have an option to save a key-frame as a jpg/bmp/whatever file to stick in the menu on the button?

Anyone here interested in such a feature?

--jdiner

Super interested! That way we have a thumbnail that isn't squished
because of us patching the file to 352x480.

That would be a great feature!

-Pr.

Pr.Sinister
03-14-2003, 09:24 AM
Originally posted by jdiner
Well. Those that guessed that doing it as completely seperate MPEGs were right.

Damn i'm good! :D

Fugg
03-14-2003, 09:48 AM
posted by jdiner
"...the mux'er out there that I can see all make the same assumptions and so mux the output wrong. This is why we can't just split and go to any tool and load the ES files."
Spruceup will accept good elementals directly from vsplit with no problems, but I feed it muxed mpeg's after editing. Actually, I'm doing this with great success:
Taking the split elemental output, feeding to a third party muxer(tmpgenc's simple mux or mplex), simple editing and passing to an app for title set generation.

If the muxed files I get this way are wrong, is the program I'm using to author my dvd's(spruceup) accepting the incorrectly muxed files due to a quirk in the program? Have I just lucked up on a procedure that works in my case?

posted by jdiner
"The mux'er in DVDWorkshop is better than most of the others I have seen. But it is still not doing things the best possible way."
What's the difference between the muxer in dvdws and tmpgenc or mplex? Are they doing something incorrectly and I'm just not seeing the problem?

posted by jdiner
"But the since the DVDWS program remux'es this is lost."
from reading other forums, it looks like DVDWS also re-encodes the mpeg's unless you...

posted at http://www.dvdrhelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=132189
"In order for DVDWS to stop re-encoding your mpeg2 files , on the Finish Step, when you choose Make Disc, simply set a bitrate HIGHER than the one you used for encoding your Mpeg2 file."
i don't have DVDWS, but I've heard from others that this does keep it from re-encoding...

Is there something about dvdws that makes it better than spruceup for our purposes?

Please forgive me if I've missed the mark, but I'm having such good luck with your tools and tmpgenc/mplex muxers. ... and mplex is opensource. Could you use some of this and save yourself some time?

Thanks for all the hard work you've done and please disregard this if I've missed something obvious. I'm just a simple guy, but I mean well...

Pr.Sinister
03-14-2003, 11:45 AM
Originally posted by Fugg

from reading other forums, it looks like DVDWS also re-encodes the mpeg's unless you...

i don't have DVDWS, but I've heard from others that this does keep it from re-encoding...



It doesn't re-encode if you set VBR... it never re-encoded for me...
It creates a full 4gig DVD in 15 min so i am 100% sure it's not
re-encoding cause i use a lowly PIII-933 for this... :)

-Pr.

sky12
03-14-2003, 12:19 PM
Originally posted by bato
I'm waiting for DVDLab (http://www.mediachance.com/dvdlab/index.html) , it will cost $79 and I hope we can import the files just as we import in MF2/DVDWS, if not, maybe the author can make it work.

The program looks good, and the price is alot better than DVDWS.
From reading the web page, it looks like it does some strict checking for proper mpeg video which probably means TiVo Mpeg is out.
But, have you tried contacting the author? Explain what we're trying to do? I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to have an option in preferences to slack off the strict checking (with an appropriate warning that what comes out might be less than perfect)

Greg

bato
03-14-2003, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by sky12
But, have you tried contacting the author? Explain what we're trying to do? I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to have an option in preferences to slack off the strict checking (with an appropriate warning that what comes out might be less than perfect)

Greg
Not yet, I'm waiting for the release, then test it, and then ask the author about it if it fails.

I wish the strict check is the same as DVDWS, if it's the same as Maestro then we have problems because the elements from Tytool many times don't have GOP errors but the edited and muxed mpg from vsplitmux and then demux with TMPGEnc always have GOP errors and can't work with Maestro. More info about this later in some howtos with pictures I'm planing to make this weekend.

BubbleLamp
03-14-2003, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by jdiner
Well. It took me longer than I wanted it too. But I figured out why the audio is getting off.

The mux'er in DVDWorkshop is better than most of the others I have seen. But it is still not doing things the best possible way.

I thought I had sync fixed but found out that I was wrong. The problem is that if you have a data->cut->data segment. Right now I am producing the PTS/DTS values so that things stay sync'ed and happy.

But the since the DVDWS program remux'es this is lost. They could keep it, much like I am doing now, but they don't. So reguardless of what they "could be doing" they aren't. So since the cuts do line up perfectly thanks to the video being the restriction you get off. Somewhere between 0 and 23.999 MS off in the audio playing to early at every cut during the DVDWS remux step.

So the only chance is the multiple output files approach. But even then the initial sync is still an issue as if it dumping that information then things are going to be a bit off from start to finish.

I am just now verifying what is going on with that.

--jdiner

Josh, did you try what Pr.S said a while back, doing a diff on a file simple-remuxed with TMPG and the source file output from vsplitmux? It's doing something that fixes the files.

khmann
03-14-2003, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by spinxter

Detail on the last item: I trade bootleg concert videos of Alice Cooper. These were made with camcorders.

...TiVo chokes on blank tape.



yes it does. It chokes on any kind of video sync error. TiVo hates VCRs in general. One little tracking error, and audio & video sync goes completely to crap. what you need is a TBC - Time Base Corrector. a devices that digitally regenerates video frames. they used to be really expensive items used by professional video folks. nowadays everyones gone digital, so they're a little cheaper.

Search ebay for 'TBC' - look for brands like 'hotronics' 'DPS' 'Nova'. My hotronics PC-TBC ($200) resulted in a phenomenal increase in picture quality from my Hi8 camcorder tapes. The jittery, twitchy video is gone, and the audio stays synced. now I can even use the fast forward and still pause of the camera and the TiVo still displays it. sweet.

snoopy
03-14-2003, 02:20 PM
Originally posted by newbie
[B]...I've been capturing (Windvd) the title screen to make jewel case inserts.

Have you tried getting your jewel case inserts here (http://www.cdcovers.cc/search.php) ?

newbie
03-14-2003, 02:29 PM
Yes (also Google/image search). My wife had my record a few (very old) movies off TCM. There were a couple of movies I couldn't find a usable picture from the usual sources and used the WinDVD screen capture. Really not a bad solution.

AlphaWolf
03-14-2003, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by newbie

FOR A SHORT TERM SOLUTION I wish both developers would concentrate on giving us standard files. Eventually the programs may be all we need but right now it would be good if we can easily use third party tools.


This is the direction that all of the tystudio developers are already going in. Everything that tystudio does is based on an already existing standard. While TyStudio will include its own tools for doing everything you could possibly want to do with a tystream, it also makes everything compatible with already existing third party software. Not sure if olaf or myself have said this earlier, but tystudio is actualy a part of an already existing open source dvd-creation project for linux (and other platforms as well).

snoopy
03-14-2003, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by AlphaWolf
This is the direction that all of the tystudio developers are already going in. Everything that tystudio does is based on an already existing standard. While TyStudio will include its own tools for doing everything you could possibly want to do with a tystream, it also makes everything compatible with already existing third party software. Not sure if olaf or myself have said this earlier, but tystudio is actualy a part of an already existing open source dvd-creation project for linux (and other platforms as well).

I have not yet switched sides because I was waiting on Jdiner's stuff to get completed. With so much controversy over standards I think it might be time to have a look. What is the current process over there? Can someone PM me the "short" of it in terms of steps.

AlphaWolf
03-14-2003, 04:04 PM
Well, I don't realy view it as "sides", just I have played an active role in tystudio so I have a good idea as to whats happening, whereas I haven't spent as much time with vsplit. The installers are just about done so I can explain it from start to finish.

The install process will go the same for either linux, mac, or windows: just download and run a file, follow the prompts, takes but a few seconds, and the install is done. On the tivo side, just upload only one file, run it, and follow the prompts, takes but a few seconds, we even take care of configuring your rc.sysinit.

Then you just run tystudio, it has one button for opening a local
Tystream, and another for opening a tystream straight from your tivo
without extracting it beforehand. You can create editing cut points
either way.

The indexing on the tivo side can be done in realtime when you select
the show from a 'Now Showing' list, but this is slow. Better solutions
are to have the indexing daemon installed on the Tivo or to download the
file to your PC for indexing, there is an option to download on the
editor's now showing screen. If you have had the indexer installed long
enough on the tivo, then you'll only need to wait a few seconds for a
pre-prepared index to be downloaded.

Once you are finished marking the cuts, just select how you want the
video to be output: dvd compliant, svcd compliant, a simple mux or split
into two elementary streams. You then select how you want the audio
output; you can change the MPEG sampling rate, convert it to or from
AC3, or leave it as is.

Then you just hit the process button. After a few minutes, you get a
video file and an audio file (if requested) on your local hard disk cut
and formatted as requested.

Other useful features include:
Ability to save stills in various common formats for DVD menus
Straight processing without cutting
Downloading .ty files from TIVO without processing

EDIT: our "official" description.

newbie
03-14-2003, 04:13 PM
AW-- I've tried to use tyremux to split ty files (extracted with tytools6). In every case the program crashes. I am wondering if tystudio will have the some problems. I am nervous about doing too much on the Tivo, I think I'd prefer to just extract and do the real work on the PC.

AlphaWolf
03-14-2003, 04:21 PM
Its being worked out and is extremely safe to do things tivo side. In fact, we don't even use any tcl scripts, so theres no tivosh involved, which causes most of the problems that you see when working on the tivo side (not using tivosh also provides for a HUGE speed increase in listing the nowshowing). Either way, you aren't forced into doing local edits or tivo edits, its purely optional.

The crashes you saw in tydemux should probably be fixed by now. There was actualy a tydemux version 0.4.3 that was never released which included some of these fixes. They aren't all gone of course, thats why tystudio 0.5.0 will be released as either an alpha or a beta, but for the most part it should work well.

MrBassMan
03-14-2003, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by newbie
AW-- I've tried to use tyremux to split ty files (extracted with tytools6). In every case the program crashes. I am wondering if tystudio will have the some problems. I am nervous about doing too much on the Tivo, I think I'd prefer to just extract and do the real work on the PC.

Although tyStudio CAN mark cuts and process remote files, all the same functionality is also available for .ty files on you hard disk.

The only difference is the dialog used to select the file.

BTW: As one of the main developers on tyStudio - I would like to distance myself from the jdiner bashing going on here.

Josh has provided us with some good tools that work well for many people. This is not an us and him situation - we are all one big happy Tivo extraction family.

Please - keep things sweet if you want Josh to continue producing FREE stuff for YOU.

snoopy
03-14-2003, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by AlphaWolf
Its being worked out and is extremely safe to do things tivo side. In fact, we don't even use any tcl scripts, so theres no tivosh involved, which causes most of the problems that you see when working on the tivo side (not using tivosh also provides for a HUGE speed increase in listing the nowshowing). Either way, you aren't forced into doing local edits or tivo edits, its purely optional.

The crashes you saw in tydemux should probably be fixed by now. There was actualy a tydemux version 0.4.3 that was never released which included some of these fixes. They aren't all gone of course, thats why tystudio 0.5.0 will be released as either an alpha or a beta, but for the most part it should work well.

HM, I don't want to write here about Olafs work for fear of rehashing un-necessary controversy. i would however, like to understand the benefits of concentrating on that side of the discussion. Can you PM with some particulars? Some of what you just said went over my head because my concentration right now is on TYTool 6r3. I know NOTHING about stuff with the "tivo side" as you put it. I was referring to Olaf's work when I spoke of sides. Again, please post a response in a PM. The people here are wonderfull and have helped me a great deal!

AlphaWolf
03-14-2003, 04:52 PM
I have PM disabled on this forum for various reasons. But I am not sure what you are refering to here specificaly...

BubbleLamp
03-14-2003, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by MrBassMan
BTW: As one of the main developers on tyStudio - I would like to distance myself from the jdiner bashing going on here.

Josh has provided us with some good tools that work well for many people. This is not an us and him situation - we are all one big happy Tivo extraction family.

Please - keep things sweet if you want Josh to continue producing FREE stuff for YOU.

Amen, now all you need to do is convince the rest of your "team" to behave in a like manner.

jjjones
03-14-2003, 05:31 PM
Originally posted by AlphaWolf

Then you just run tystudio, it has one button for opening a local
Tystream, and another for opening a tystream straight from your tivo without extracting it beforehand. You can create editing cut points either way.




A Ty player and editor?


jj;)

MrBassMan
03-14-2003, 05:53 PM
Originally posted by jjjones
A Ty player and editor?


jj;)
Currently a very jerky player with no sound!

The player gets still frames from the stream by the fastest method possible - something called a GOP header. This means it's not a true frame editor (YET) - that would require further decoding of the MPEG - but one day?

It's too complicated to get into now - there is lots of information in other threads on the subject.

snoopy
03-15-2003, 03:21 AM
Originally posted by AlphaWolf
I have PM disabled on this forum for various reasons. But I am not sure what you are refering to here specificaly...

Specifically, I was referring to the post I quoted and the stuff below it that I wrote.

np, thanks for your posts. They are most helpfull.

Immo
03-15-2003, 08:18 PM
Jdiner,

Your tools are awesome and it appears that Ulead DVD MovieMaker will accept the outputs. There are two issues that would make the transition perfect for DVD authoring of multiple ty converted mpegs:

Incorporate the DVDPatcher function on the generated M2V to do the 352x480 patch

Allow thumbnail snapshots in GOEditor so the DVD menu button pictures are not squished.

We would still need to patch the header back before we burn them in NERO.

Nice work!

Immo

snoopy
03-19-2003, 03:41 AM
Originally posted by Immo
Jdiner,

Your tools are awesome and it appears that Ulead DVD MovieMaker will accept the outputs. There are two issues that would make the transition perfect for DVD authoring of multiple ty converted mpegs:

Incorporate the DVDPatcher function on the generated M2V to do the 352x480 patch

Allow thumbnail snapshots in GOEditor so the DVD menu button pictures are not squished.

We would still need to patch the header back before we burn them in NERO.

Nice work!

This sure does seem like a simple solution to me. One that many people have alluded to.

Immo

jdiner
03-22-2003, 03:57 PM
The source code for tserver_mfs has been released in the bin/howto sticky thread.

Just an FYI really.

--jdiner