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cyberhide
06-05-2003, 01:36 AM
I've tried every combination of cable, jumper settings, etc. I even tried multiple computers, but I cant get my quantum fireball lct 40gb to spin up in my pc. Strange thing is that if i put it back in my hughes gxcebot it works fine, spins up and runs. Also, when I place the drive in one of my pc's, the led on the quantum drive flashes 10 times over and over.

Please tell me im not going insane here! :)

Maybe Im missing something?

-Cyberhide

captain_video
06-05-2003, 08:24 AM
Nope, sorry. You're definitely going insane. The only thing I can think of is just make sure you've got your IDE cable configured correctly when connecting the drive in your PC (red stripe to pin 1). Make sure you don't have any conflicts with other drives on the same IDE cable (i.e. both configured as master or slave). The Quantum drives come configured as cable select by default so make sure it's on another setting in your PC.

cyberhide
06-05-2003, 10:39 AM
This is the strange thing.. even with just the power cable attached, no data cable, it still will not power up. A hard drive will always power up with just a power cable attached, but this one wont. The LED flashes 10 times and never powers up. I put it back in the tivo, and bam, it powers up within 2-3 seconds of applying power to my tivo.

I do know my way around a computer, and i initially tried cable select on its own cable/channel, since that was the least amount of work. Then I tried slave (with my primary master on the cable as well), and that didnt work. I even tried master by itself on the cable/channel. I've tried this in 2 machines, applying just power, and both time it just sits there and flashes its light at me. This is driving me nuts :)

-Cyberhide

cyberhide
06-06-2003, 03:50 PM
Ok, I figured it out... but damn this is strange. I tried 3 power supplies, to see if I could just get it to spin up. And all 3 gave me a no spin up, flashing led. So then i tried the tivo power supply, and it worked! So i hooked up the drive cable into my pc and turned on my pc and did it that way. I just have no clue as to why 3 power supplies (different brands) all would behave this way. I would think either antec, enlight, or enermax would make compitent power supplies.

-Cyberhide

captain_video
06-06-2003, 04:48 PM
That is indeed strange. I'm wondering if there isn't a cold solder joint for the power connector on the driver controller board. Perhaps it just liked the Tivo environment better than the PC. There's absolutely no rational reason why the drive wouldn't work in a Tivo and not a PC unless there was something funky going on. I'd be concerned that the drive is suspect. You might check with the drive manufacturer and see if the drive is still under warranty. If it is I'd see about getting a replacement because you never know when the drive may decide to quit in the Tivo as well. If you can make a backup image of the drive using the configuration you described you can restore it to the replacement drive when it arrives.

cyberhide
06-06-2003, 05:55 PM
Well my original plan was to add a second drive, a 120gb maybe. But maybe I'll just skip that and replace the first drive with the 120gb. See how that works. I'lll investigate the ps wiring to the molex tonight to see if it is any different.

captain_video
06-06-2003, 06:50 PM
You'd be better off using the 120GB drive as your A drive anyway. If you end up getting the original drive replaced you can always add it as your B drive later.

m_gerbik
09-02-2003, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by cyberhide
I've tried every combination of cable, jumper settings, etc. I even tried multiple computers, but I cant get my quantum fireball lct 40gb to spin up in my pc.
Please tell me im not going insane here! :)

You aren't going insane. I have the same issue and eventually just downloaded an image so that I could complete my upgrade to a 120G drive. I would like to be able to reuse this drive now in a Linux machine and was wondering if anyone out there found a way to permanently fix this problem with that drive. I read somewhere that TiVo intentionally altered these drives to prevent hacking so that they wouldn't spin up in PCs, but that person said that special IDE commands at boot coaxed the drive to spin up, not the power supply as you found. Any help? Could use the extra space as I have a 9G in that machine.

Thanks!
Chris

cyberhide
09-02-2003, 11:23 PM
I am still using that 40gig quantum drive in my tivo, but I had to use the power supply from the tivo to get it to power up when connected to my computer. I believe that the power plug or power supply / hard drive have been modified in some way to prevent it from being used with a standard power supply. I tried several power supplies, several hd's (to test my sanity), and came out with one final conclusion. The quantum hd in my tivo can only be powered by the power supply in a tivo.

Long story short, I just used the power supply in the tivo to power the drive, but connected the ide to my computer to load the image.

I have had no time/interest to poke at the power supply / hard drive to figure out what modification had been done. Oh well, atleast I was able to get it to work :D

-Cyberhide

BubbleLamp
09-02-2003, 11:55 PM
No, the Tivo connectors/drives are not different. What may cause it is a mangled connector, or a drive set for cable controlled spin-up.

m_gerbik
09-03-2003, 01:11 AM
Originally posted by BubbleLamp
No, the Tivo connectors/drives are not different. What may cause it is a mangled connector, or a drive set for cable controlled spin-up. But cyberhide's experience contradicts that scenario absolutely. My experience is also that it spins up in the Tivo even with the IDE cable disconnected, but will not spin up with any configuration in multiple PCs. There is definitely no connector issue. :confused:

BubbleLamp
09-03-2003, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by m_gerbik
But cyberhide's experience contradicts that scenario absolutely. My experience is also that it spins up in the Tivo even with the IDE cable disconnected, but will not spin up with any configuration in multiple PCs. There is definitely no connector issue. :confused:

Sorry, I don't buy it. I've had the Quantum's out of 3 SA Tivo's and 2 DTivo's and all work fine on my PC. I'd look elsewhere, but if you want to believe it takes a secret handshake, whatever floats your boat.

m_gerbik
09-03-2003, 01:27 AM
Originally posted by BubbleLamp
Sorry, I don't buy it. I've had the Quantum's out of 3 SA Tivo's and 2 DTivo's and all work fine on my PC. I'd look elsewhere, but if you want to believe it takes a secret handshake, whatever floats your boat. Well that's fine to say, but the fact remains that when I put other devices in these PCs using the same connectors they work fine. I mean I'm not saying I know what the deal is, but it's not a mangled power connector and since the drive spins up in the Tivo without IDE connected then it can't need an IDE signal to spin up. I guess I don't get what point you are trying to make. The reality is it's a drive that functions perfectly in the DirecTiVo unit, but does not so much as spin up let alone get recognized by the BIOS in multiple PCs that function perfectly with other devices. I'm just asking if anyone knows why that is and hopefully how to overcome it.

GREEK
09-03-2003, 04:17 AM
If you think about it, how would the drive even get to use tehe "secret handshake" if it wont power up first? I have never heard of such a thing, like bubblelamp, I have imaged 100s of quantums, and do them daily on repairs and upgrades. I have seen locked drives, but not this no spin up business. THere are 100 rumors around the dtv world including the tivo corner. Not to say anything negative, I'm just saying I would be surprised. I did a search for the hell of it at TCF and nothing remotely came up. The previous post about the power supplies is funny too, I build custom computers also and power supplies are finicky. The fact you did try different jumpers and settings/ribbons is crazy, were just missing something here. Good work around BTW, gotta use your head sometimes:D

pcdubay
09-04-2003, 06:34 PM
Alot of really technical opinions here...that's good...
A situation I ran into was similar...maybe

After not getting my PC to "spin up" my Hdrives, figured it was a bios issue...pulled my hair out to locate a bios upgrade...nope. too old of a motherboard...

Any way...got looking closer and noticed 1 (of the 4)connector pin was backing out very slightly as I was plugging it in..very tough to see that happen...
Shoved it into place....BAM...booted up..saw everthing..working great....
My point being....don't overlook the simple things...

Good luck

cyberhide
09-05-2003, 06:23 PM
Out of curiosity, I tried again last night to use the tivo hd in my pc, without the ide connector, just the power cable. I checked to make sure no pins were pushed back, and that the connection was solid. I turned it on and the drive just flashed its led a few times and wont do anything. I then in turn placed it back in the tivo, just the power cable again, checked the pin connections, and fired it up. The hd spun up as normal. I have no clue what is going on here, but I know its not a secret handshake (no ide connector involved), and i also know its not my power supply. So all I know is what works and what doesnt. It definately seems to be a power supply issue, and something with the tivo power supply.

Just my two cents,
Cyberhide

roundfile
09-14-2003, 12:30 PM
I've seen exactly the same thing -- was tearing my hair out trying to get my SAT-T60 Quantum Fireball lct20 40GB recognized by any PC. I tried four different PC models and it was never seen. Nothing worked until I saw cyberhide's post and tried the TiVo power supply. Now it works 100% of the time.

My guess is that the Quantum drive is OEM to TiVo with power sequencing required. Typical PCs don't power sequence, but the TiVo supply probably does (i.e. brings one voltage up and stable before the other is brought up). Without the proper 5V/12V sequence the drive does not come up. Quantum/Maxtor's manual says sequencing is not required but I can think of no other explanation. Anyone with some test gear can prove or disprove this assertion.

Anyway, thanks to cyberhide for the suggestion.

-rf

BubbleLamp
09-14-2003, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by roundfile
I've seen exactly the same thing -- was tearing my hair out trying to get my SAT-T60 Quantum Fireball lct20 40GB recognized by any PC. I tried four different PC models and it was never seen. Nothing worked until I saw cyberhide's post and tried the TiVo power supply. Now it works 100% of the time.

My guess is that the Quantum drive is OEM to TiVo with power sequencing required. Typical PCs don't power sequence, but the TiVo supply probably does (i.e. brings one voltage up and stable before the other is brought up). Without the proper 5V/12V sequence the drive does not come up. Quantum/Maxtor's manual says sequencing is not required but I can think of no other explanation. Anyone with some test gear can prove or disprove this assertion.

Anyway, thanks to cyberhide for the suggestion.

-rf

Interesting theory. I don't buy it, but interesting. Next time I have the top off one of my DSR's I'll put a couple of meters on the 5V/12V lines and let you know. Or you can take your Quantum and connect it to the PC with jumpers and try to add one voltage at a time. A virtual six-pack and my apologies to you guys if you're right. ;)

cyberhide
09-14-2003, 11:52 PM
Its always good to know that my pain and frustration ended up helping someone else out. :D I hadn't thought of power sequencing as a possible cause, but I will have to throw my meter on the pins sometime to see if thats the case.

Atleast I've moved beyond this problem and I'm now enjoying my modified tivo :)

-Cyberhide