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mrblack51
12-03-2003, 03:18 PM
Well, over the thanksgiving break, I decided to do some investigation into the DVD/TiVo combo units. As such, I am sharing the results of my investigations so far.

There are two types of dvd combo units: dvd players and dvd writers. There is only one dvd player unit currently (the Toshiba SD-400) while there are two dvd writer units - the Pioneer DVR-810H and the Pioneer DVR-57H. The units share many similarities, specifically:

DVD Playback (including DVD/VCD/CD-R/CD-RW/CD/DVD-R)
TiVo Series 2 functionality, including being HMO ready
"TiVo Basic" service included, with the option for "TiVo Plus"
Progressive scan output (3:2 pulldown)
One USB port
Optical output for Dolby Digital/DTS

However, there are a few differences between the various units.

Toshiba SD-400 (http://www.tacp.toshiba.com/dvr/product.asp?model=SD-H400) (pdf spec sheet (http://www.tacp.toshiba.com/pdf/sd-h400.pdf))
Street Price: $500
80Gb HDD
Only has one set of inputs?

After opening up this unit, I was less than thrilled. In short, the unit looks like a cheap Apex-style dvd player and a standard series 2 tivo shoved into a single unit, with slight changes to the tivo motherboard to add progressive output and control communication with the DVD player, and a shared power supply. The dvd player is not a standard PC dvd drive (at least in the sense that it doesn't have an IDE interface or whatnot), and interfaces direclty with a small daughterboard with a zoran chip. From the looks of it, all dvd playback stuff is handled by the zoran board, with the audio and video piped to the outputs directly.

Pioneer DVR-810H and DVR-57H (http://www.pioneerburner.com/)
Street prices: $1000 and $1500, respectively
Faroudja progressive scan output
two sets of inputs (no, not two tuners. as in two sets of composite RCA style connections on the back)
Since these units are nealy identical, the main differences are as follows:
1) regular silver exterior vs. black 'Double-Layered Chassis'
2) 80gb vs. 120gb HDD
3) silver or nickel (not sure) connectors vs. gold connectors
4) one year vs. two year warranty
5) for some reason, the 810 software install is not working with drive expansion currently, but the 57h software is...this is being investigated, could very well be a bug in mfstools 2.0

These units are based on, not surprisingly, the Pioneer 105 DVD-R/RW recorder. The drive inside the unit is the standard IDE based unit, with just a new fascia put on to match the front bezel of the unit. The differences between the units are trivial, and not really something that would be worth the extra $500 to go with the 57H (unless you really care about black vs. silver). The motherboard on the units is very different than any other tivo motherboard I have seen. While some of the differences would be attributable to the addition of the faroudja progressive scan stuff, there are some other major differences (a large pioneer BGA IC right next to the secondary IDE channel). There is also a larger fan than is used on any other tivo I have seen so far, possibly due to the heat produced by the dvd burner. Because the standard PC DVD burner was used, software dvd playback was needed, and apparently provided in the form of LinDVD (http://www.corporatemedianews.com/2003/11_nov/news/cw_intervideo_dvd.htm).

mrblack51
12-03-2003, 03:18 PM
Hackability:

I only did some basic stuff with the DVR-810H software, and never got around to messing with the SD-400 software (I was so disappointed with the internals that I never got around to it). The burning question is whether you can hack them, and the answer is yes. I don't have the tools to do the prom hack myself on these units, but I was able to do monte on them just fine. As with all s2 units, you can use the 3.1.u5 kernel and minimal filesystem from an hdvr2 as the basis for doing monte. tivoftpd and bash worked fine, tivoweb worked fine after the standard tweaks needed for 4.0 units (and maybe one more, its been a few days). I didn't have a chance to test extraction, but you should be able to extract by doing the same type of kernel and tivoapp patches that are needed on 4.0.

Expanding the hard drive on these units has apparently proved to be a bit tricky (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=143213). One nice thing about the 5.2 software is that LBA 48 was included, due to the newer version of the linux kernel which was used. My understanding is that expansion of the drive space on the SD-400 and the DVR-810H software is problematic. You can definitely use standard tools on the DVR-57H software, and you can use the DVR-57H software on the DVR-810H. I didn't test the DVR-57H software on the SD-400, though I wouldn't be surprised if it worked. Because of how the units are designed, you should still be able to use two drives (assuming they will fit in the case) on the primary IDE channel. It is unclear if anyone has attempted a 3-drive setup on the Pioneer units, with two drives on the primary IDE channel, and a third hard disk on the secondary channel with the DVD drive. The PTVupgrade guys have apparently been able to use drives on either IDE channel though.

-More to come, stay tuned-

MuscleNerd
12-03-2003, 03:58 PM
You can also successfully restore a 5.2 MFSTool backup image into a standard HDVR2 (as long as you do a clear-and-delete everything after your first boot).

Note that because it defaults to TiVo Basic mode, you'll have no real TiVo functionality until you hack past that.

I didn't try hooking up my 104 DVD recorder to the IDE bus, though. I wonder whether it would have utilized it. As it was, I had "DVD" menu item but it didn't go anywhere.

mrblack51
12-03-2003, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by MuscleNerd
You can also successfully restore a 5.2 MFSTool backup image into a standard HDVR2 (as long as you do a clear-and-delete everything after your first boot).

Note that because it defaults to TiVo Basic mode, you'll have no real TiVo functionality until you hack past that.

I didn't try hooking up my 104 DVD recorder to the IDE bus, though. I wonder whether it would have utilized it. As it was, I had "DVD" menu item but it didn't go anywhere.

I too have gotten the 810 image to restore onto my HDVR2. The biggest problem i faced was that clear and delete everything was not working from the menu structure. I was able to do a C & D E by calling the setzapfactoryreset.tcl script (i think thats the full name) from tivosh. Once it finished, i was able to go through setting up the satellite input.

the unit will get video from the satellite after that. however, i was unable to change channels due to an error #63, stating a need to upgrade the tivo service. I think this may be due to not having a dvd drive connected to the unit (fixsub didnt clear the error)...but it could also have something to do with attempting to limit the ammount of guide data or something. more investigation needed.

there are no specific references to hdc or hdd in tivoapp. the next step is to hook up a drive like the pioneer 104, 105, or 106 to the unit and see if it recognizes as the dvd drive...or maybe if there is a usb 2.0 enclosure that you could use with one of those drives...hmm

MuscleNerd
12-03-2003, 04:39 PM
It's interesting that we had two very different experiences bringing it up, even though (I think) we started from the same backup image.

I had no problems getting to clear-and-delete via the UI, and I also had no problems changing channels. I couldn't record anything, however, due to the TiVo Basic restriction. I'm confident that can be worked around, though.

I suspect the ultimate problem with using 5.2 on an HDVR2 will be that the bitrates/resolution of the DirecTV streams are not what the software expects (in fact, you can see the box complaining about the bitrates in the log files).

mrblack51
12-03-2003, 09:59 PM
Alrighty - thanks to db74 being very gracious, I now have the photos of the internals of the two units online.

Toshiba SD-400
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Toshiba%20SD-H400/Toshiba%20SD-H400%20001s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Toshiba%20SD-H400/Toshiba%20SD-H400%20003s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Toshiba%20SD-H400/Toshiba%20SD-H400%20004s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Toshiba%20SD-H400/Toshiba%20SD-H400%20005s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Toshiba%20SD-H400/Toshiba%20SD-H400%20006s.jpg

Pioneer DVR-810H
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Pioneer%20DVR-810H%20Photos/Photo%20007s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Pioneer%20DVR-810H%20Photos/Photo%20008s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Pioneer%20DVR-810H%20Photos/Photo%20009s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Pioneer%20DVR-810H%20Photos/Photo%20010s.jpg
http://tivo.dementia.org/mrblack51/Pioneer%20DVR-810H%20Photos/Photo%20011s.jpg

Edit: in case you were wondering, the wires in the toshiba unit were there when i bought it. it was open box when i picked it up, so it may have gone in for repair, but its hard to say. the hdvr2 units have wire modifications from the factory as well.

cali
12-05-2003, 10:02 AM
Thanks for the images mr.Black.

I am utterly disappointed in the internals of the Toshiba. I would not buy that until they came out with a newer rev. The amount of wires adds on the PCB is an indication of SHIT poor design, and they fixed them by just slapping wires on the board, instead of re-spinning it....suck :(

mrblack51
12-09-2003, 08:07 PM
note for anyone attempting to mess with these disk images: I was lazy, and used sleeper's iso on them. since the software comes off SA dvd units, you should select the SA option. make sure you edit your rc.sysinit.author to prevent kmem and such from running, since the original offsets won't work. i made sure to restore my image on my own, then skipped all the restore stuff in his prompts.

for those attempting to monte on their own, or using a prom mod - you must use replace_initrd rather than the various kill-initrd tools. the reason is that the ones for the s2 are tuned to specific kernel versions. since the dvd units use a different kernel version (2.4.20), the offsets will be different for the needed changes. replace_initrd is universal for any s2 kernel image.

splitsec
12-20-2003, 01:26 PM
Did either of you ever connect a DVD drive to the system? Was it as functional as the original units (ie. could you play DVD's, and could you write them?)

Sounds like an interesting long term project to work on.

mrblack51
12-21-2003, 09:35 PM
So i finally got to play with this a bit more. I am still stuck in the error #63, which appears to be related to some sort of pre-tivo-basic condition which i am investigating on how to clear.

unfortunately, its rather difficult since I don't have the 810 in front of me anymore. if anyone has a 57H or 810 and can help me, especially by giving me access to tivoweb or telnet on your unit over the internet so i can look at the mfs, it would be appreciated.

despite that, while in the error #63 condition, I can tune to whatever channel i am authorized for, i just cant get any info or pull up the guide

rc3105
12-22-2003, 09:05 PM
mfs_ftp 1.2.9p works on the 57H image / 5.2x software / 2.4.20 kernel

do NOT install tzoffset.tcl, or delete it before running mfs_ftp - (gotta fix that)

mrblack51
12-24-2003, 03:23 PM
Well, i have managed to get an 810 to play with for the next two weeks, so I am back at it again. The first thing i tried has been to attempt to burn a show from an hdvr2. The hdvr2 is unscrambled, and the show was extracted as a ty+ (so that the invalid CSO keys wouldnt be brought with it). I inserted the show into the 810, and the show played fine. however, when i attempted to burn the show using the 'copy to dvd' function, i got the following message:



this program cannot be copied to dvd because it was transfered from a DVR with incompatible audio and video formats


tivo community had a somewhat topical thread: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=149844

so, it looks like the problem may be that all the regular dtivos record in 32k, while the dvd combo units record in 44. any easy ways to check this? in any event, this is a big downer, because that means that we can't directly burn high quality rips like those that come from the dtivos. I haven't tried an extract from an s1 dtivo, but i imagine the results will be similar.

I also investigated a bit more into the message #63 thing. after comparing the /State dirs on the same image running on the 810 versus on the hdvr2 (had to do a C & D E in order to make it happy on each), the changes are relatively minor. specifically, the variables that would seem to indicate changes to the subscription dont seem to affect the msg #63 thing on the hdvr2. also, when the pioneer units are in tivo basic mode, the service state is 1 (new) and the expiration is 0.

mrblack51
12-26-2003, 05:43 PM
oh, there have been some questions here and there regarding the firmware of the dvd writer. its listed as version 1.31. this is a standard version number for the pioneer drive, so i doubt it has any special modifications for the tivo. 1.33 is the current version of the firmware available for these drives from pioneer as i recall, and there are also hacked versions of the firmware to make them RPC-1, allow 12x ripping, and allow 2x burning on all dvd-R brands of media. however, the firmware upgrade only affects the drive, there is no telling how the hacked firmware would work in the tivo hardware (and im not going to find out).

mrblack51
12-26-2003, 05:47 PM
http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/part.asp?productNum=PE5337A

If anyone has any information about this IC (its the one right next to the secondary IDE connection in the pioneer units), please let me know. thanks

rc3105
12-28-2003, 03:00 AM
Veeeeeeeeeeeeeeery interesting nugget in the 5.2 startup scripts

\etc\rc.d\StageE_PreApplication

# File: rc.CheckForUpgradeDisc.sh
#
# Description: Stage E system startup script fragment
# Check for, and load, software slices present on a
# properly-signed external medium

basically if you have a usb hd/zip/floppy/flashcard/pen-drive plugged in, with an upgrade on it, it'll install automatically

tiguere
12-29-2003, 01:15 AM
I forgot to say that I also attached a DVR-ROM (not a recorder) to the IDE cable setup as slave. The hdvr2 booted normally, found the drive while booting but the unit acted just as if the drive was not there. I even inserted a DVD to see if could get a reaction.... none!

About my last post, if someone would like to investigate further about the C&D E error, here is a .txt file with the exact message I receive.

mrblack51
12-29-2003, 03:11 AM
MrBlack, I restored 5.2 on my hdvr2, tiny-init-replaced-the-kernel and applied the fixsub40 hack and got to the same point you were: C&D E doesn't works, it just reboots and spit a Fatal error through serial Bash about "Thread myworld(205) strayed", also I get the same Error #63 you do when trying to see the guide or to record something.

Something curious is that if you press the tivo button, go to "Now Playing"
and then press the guide, you get to see the guide without the "Service Unavailable message".

By the way, thanks a lot for all the help you bring to this forum. Your replace_initrd script works like a charm. :)

if you want to do a C & D E, the only way i have found on the 5.2 on hdvr2 units is to do 'tivosh /tvlib/tcl/tv/setzaprequestfactoryreset.tcl' from bash, then restarting the unit. now, have you been able to see the full guide in standard dtv style grid format? hmmm, have to try that.

mrblack51
12-29-2003, 03:17 AM
I forgot to say that I also attached a DVR-ROM (not a recorder) to the IDE cable setup as slave. The hdvr2 booted normally, found the drive while booting but the unit acted just as if the drive was not there. I even inserted a DVD to see if could get a reaction.... none!

well, the most likely cause is that the tivo wants the drive on hdc (i think). so, if you could somehow trick the tivo into thinking that hdb is hdc with a little /dev trickery, then you might be able to get it to use it. of course, the restrictions on this unit wanting a pioneer 105 or something similar may be fairly strict, but that remains to be seen.

AlphaWolf
12-29-2003, 03:29 AM
Just some useless two cents here:

Seeing as how images from different S2 units are cross compatible, its possible that tivo is trying to keep all software versions concurrent across all architectures, trying to make it as hardware independent as possible. Therefore, they could be implimenting some kind of API that would work with any arbitrary dvd drive, unless of course they planned on using the same brand dvd drive with every single tivo that they ever make *shrug* :D

tiguere
12-29-2003, 12:19 PM
if you want to do a C & D E, the only way i have found on the 5.2 on hdvr2 units is to do 'tivosh /tvlib/tcl/tv/setzaprequestfactoryreset.tcl' from bash, then restarting the unit. now, have you been able to see the full guide in standard dtv style grid format? hmmm, have to try that.

MrBlack, yes, I was able to get the guide, NOT the Grid guide but the List one (hdvr2 manual pag 49) .

Is there an utility that would let me see the tivo DB (alas phpmyadmin) ?. Or better yet, do you know where can I read about this? (I 100% agree with you on the spoon feeding issue).

I will try getting the DVD on the hdc and I'll let you know.

mrblack51
12-29-2003, 04:45 PM
MrBlack, yes, I was able to get the guide, NOT the Grid guide but the List one (hdvr2 manual pag 49) .

Is there an utility that would let me see the tivo DB (alas phpmyadmin) ?. Or better yet, do you know where can I read about this? (I 100% agree with you on the spoon feeding issue).

I will try getting the DVD on the hdc and I'll let you know.

im not sure what phpmyadmin does, so i cant be real specific. tivoweb gives you a nice interface for the mfs. you cant change stuff, but you can see what is there. tivosh is the natural way to do stuff. do a search on that and mfs, and look at some scripts to find some of the commands. also, jkeegan's book is a pretty good resource for mfs stuff.

mrblack51
12-31-2003, 09:58 PM
the 5.2 software seems to be quite buggy. while it works fine from a UI standpoint, there seems to be a number of utilities which tivo has broken knowingly or unknowingly, such as fsfix.

tiguere
12-31-2003, 10:52 PM
the 5.2 software seems to be quite buggy. while it works fine from a UI standpoint, there seems to be a number of utilities which tivo has broken knowingly or unknowingly, such as fsfix.

Is a shame to read that. I noticed certain things to be not working as supposed, but I thought it was caused by the software being run in a foreign hardware (hdvr2).

By the way, I tried again to put the dvd-rom and mount it. The first time I booted with the dvd-rom connected, it corrupted the hard disk until I finally got the Green Screen of Death. I traced down the problem to a faulty IDE cable.

I reimaged the drive, Monted, killed-init-ered the kernel. This time everything worked fine. But when trying to mount the dvdrom to /mnt/cdrom (did you notice this mount point is already there?), I got an error, something like "no driver found | no driver present" or something like that.

I stopped there and decided to install Red Hat on another hard disk, setup a cross compiler and compile an S2 version of the following files:
cdrom.o (already present on the /lib/modules dir)
ide-mod.o
ide-cd.o
ide-probe-mod.o
isofs.o

If you have some insights or recomendations, I would be glad to hear them ;)

mrblack51
01-30-2004, 01:33 PM
Further investigation has shown that, once the msg #63 condition has been cleared, the 5.2 software will properly pull up the guide and such. DTV grid style guide is not available on 5.2. also, even though the guide is displayed, only the current show is listed, not any of the upcoming shows. this issue is being investigated.

I went ahead and picked up an 810 to keep (well, until the HD-dtivo comes out), so hopefully i can make some progress.

mrblack51
02-19-2004, 08:18 PM
Im intereseted in purchasing the Pioneer Elite 57h, a few questions to clarify please.

Is there a way to access bash without doing the prom hack?
Is there a hack to allow full tivo functionallity? is this the #63 error? how can it be cleared?

since I'm not in north america, I would run the unit with the service emulator, will it allow utilities like fixsub and timzone adjust to work?

thanks,
Jai

This isnt a newbie thread, so this question really shouldnt be here (this is a dev/exploration thread...hence the title)...however, i will answer it since some points deserve clarification for readers here.

The tivo service, as of version 5.x, is authorized via encrypted keys reffered to as spigots. During the daily call, the tivo will get the current spigot key for the machine necessary to activate the functionality for another month or whatever. fixsub will not provide the necessary info to turn off the nags - this is part of what msg 63 is all about.

as stated earlier in the thread, monte works just fine. as for using the service emulator stuff, it should work if you can get around the msg 63 issue. however, if you are outside north america, there is still the pal vs. ntsc issue to deal with.

mrblack51
02-20-2004, 12:52 AM
Ok thanks Mr Black, however I've seen that you said you can get around the #63 error but haven't explained how to, are you please able to explain how to get around the #63 error thanks.

its a tivoapp patch. it will not probably not be release publically since it enables free tivo+ service as a side effect.

mrblack51
02-23-2004, 08:51 PM
For those that have hacked it into working on the directivo, does it function at least as well as 3.1 ? By this I mean: Is it usable or glitchy, responsive or slow?

If you're running 5.x on your directivo, and actually use it instead of 4.0 or 3.1, I'd appreciate your impressions.

5.x is definitely not desirable as the day-to-day software for your directivo. a number of issues exist, including the msg #63 issue, lack of grid style guide, as well as some bugs. There are no new features for an end user to gain at this point - specifically dvd functionality is not enabled yet.

bottom line, the only worthwhile 'crossdressing' that is available today is 4.0 on a dtivo, since you get folders. other than that, no real gains come from any of it.

mrblack51
03-07-2004, 05:51 PM
Is there anyone who's tried using the HMO MultiRoom viewing between a regular S2 and a DVR-810H to burn shows from the S2?

yes, and it doesnt work. there may be some hacking that can be done to fix that, but as of now it wont work.

ChromePlanet
03-30-2004, 10:56 PM
Is there anyone who's tried using the HMO MultiRoom viewing between a regular S2 and a DVR-810H to burn shows from the S2?

Not only does that not work, but you can't even burn shows transferred from one 810 to another. I know, I have 2. TiVo claims it's a legal issue, although the error message you get makes you think it's about compatibility. It's not.

ChromePlanet
03-31-2004, 01:39 PM
whats the exact message it puts up? if we know what it is, we know where to start looking to patch

"This program cannot be copied to DVD because it was transferred from a DVR with incompatible audio and video formats."

RisingPhoenix
04-10-2004, 06:05 PM
Not only does that not work, but you can't even burn shows transferred from one 810 to another. I know, I have 2. TiVo claims it's a legal issue, although the error message you get makes you think it's about compatibility. It's not.

How did you transfer the shows? Did you dd one drive to another or using HMO?

mrblack51
04-11-2004, 12:47 AM
How did you transfer the shows? Did you dd one drive to another or using HMO?

shows have been transfered via HMO, as well as via mfs_ftp. both produce the same result

mrblack51
04-18-2004, 03:28 PM
after some further investigation, it appears taht the tivo is writing dvd info to /dev/sg3. its unclear whether sg3 is the bridge, sgram, or the dvd-rw drive itself.



bash-2.02# cat /proc/scsi/sg/device_strs
Pioneer GS bridge 0001
Pioneer GS SDRAM 0001
Pioneer GS FL SPI 0001
PIONEER DVD-RW DVR-77H 1.31
Pioneer GS DAC SPI 0001
bash-2.02# cat /proc/scsi/scsi
Attached devices:
Host: scsi0 Channel: 00 Id: 00 Lun: 00
Vendor: Pioneer Model: GS bridge Rev: 0001
Type: Communications ANSI SCSI revision: ffffffff
Host: scsi0 Channel: 00 Id: 01 Lun: 00
Vendor: Pioneer Model: GS SDRAM Rev: 0001
Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: ffffffff
Host: scsi0 Channel: 00 Id: 02 Lun: 00
Vendor: Pioneer Model: GS FL SPI Rev: 0001
Type: Communications ANSI SCSI revision: ffffffff
Host: scsi0 Channel: 00 Id: 03 Lun: 00
Vendor: PIONEER Model: DVD-RW DVR-77H Rev: 1.31
Type: CD-ROM ANSI SCSI revision: 02
Host: scsi0 Channel: 00 Id: 04 Lun: 00
Vendor: Pioneer Model: GS DAC SPI Rev: 0001
Type: Communications ANSI SCSI revision: ffffffff
bash-2.02# cat /proc/scsi/sg/version
30124 Version: 3.1.24 (20020505)
bash-2.02# ls -al /dev/sg3
crw-rw-rw- 1 0 0 21, 3 Sep 22 2003 /dev/sg3
bash-2.02# cat /proc/scsi/gs/0
SCSI host number 0 : Giant Slalom Scsi Driver
Bridge : UP
ATAPI : ATTACHED
SDRAM : 8388608

jonbig
04-18-2004, 10:02 PM
after some further investigation, it appears taht the tivo is writing dvd info to /dev/sg3. its unclear whether sg3 is the bridge, sgram, or the dvd-rw drive itself.

I believe that "sg" is the generic SCSI driver, which allows programs to send raw scsi commands directly to devices.

rc3105
05-22-2004, 04:10 AM
some of the resources like dvd menu structures are stored in fsids. a sleeper style -4138 mfstool backup will NOT copy those and a restored image won't be able to burn dvd's :eek:

after further investigation, my 810H-80 image required -5689 and mrblack's 810H-120 needed -5690

just to be safe, -5700 should backup all the needed resources - but it's still good to keep the original drive on a shelf somewhere ;)

mrblack51
05-22-2004, 12:16 PM
some of the resources like dvd menu structures are stored in fsids. a sleeper style -4138 mfstool backup will NOT copy those and a restored image won't be able to burn dvd's :eek:

after further investigation, my 810H-80 image required -5689 and mrblack's 810H-120 needed -5690

just to be safe, -5700 should backup all the needed resources - but it's still good to keep the original drive on a shelf somewhere ;)

mine needed two resources - the topmenu3 and the titlemenu3. by reinserting a copy (thanks rc3105) of the ty files, i was able to take a backup image that was lacking the streams and restored and let it burn again.

the telltale sign for this being a problem is that the burn will go fine all the way to the end, but right before its done, the burn will fail with an internal error. looking at the disk itself, you will see and unburned ring in the center of the disk.

mrblack51
06-06-2004, 11:57 PM
5.2 seems to work on a sa2, but recordings made there won't burn when moved back to a 810 (even if you move the whole drive & nuke the DC key)

oh well, worth a shot

recordings from another 810 didnt seem to burn properly, same error as anything else transffered from another tivo. time to keep hunting

rc3105
08-19-2004, 08:18 PM
just had ocassion to try the ,#311 dialing prefix on a 810H@5.2.1a and it worked. nice to know it'll still be possible to do an initial setup "call" if the modem kerplodes

edit: ",#401" works for guided setup if networking is configured

DanShady
09-08-2004, 02:50 AM
So I got the 810H to take a Maxtor 250GB using the PTVUpgrade's MFStools 2.0 CD with LBA48 support... then I threw sleeper's monte on it, skipping backup and restore. I chose Ax8817x because I'm using a Dlink DUB-E100... incidently, this was a bad choice because I didn't think about sleeper's iso being 2.4.4, so the 810's 2.4.20 kernel had its problems with that. I recoppied the modules out of my orig drive and that cleaned up well enough--minus the fact that the orig drive with 2.4.20 didnt have hcd.o on it. I dont know if this will be a prob or not--insight is appreciated, I know its gone back and forth as to if it is needed or not as builds go by...

So after some toying around, and noting in the var logs that insmod was trying to load usbcore and ax8817x multiple times--I commented out all of the insmods for ethernet on the rc.sysinit.author file... system loaded up fine. I think this took care of my "missing hcd.o" thing--not sure. I could connect out to get a new guide fine--lights are happy on the DUB-E100. Going to the 810, I can ping, but I can't telnet from my laptop or hit tivoftp or tivoweb.

When you fellas did your 810s, did you use hacks on sleepers to put these in place or do it manually? If you used sleepers--any ideas on why I can only ping from outside and nothing else? Outbound connections look fine... and of course due to the nature of the hardware of the 810--getting a bash serial connection isnt exactly doable...

rc3105
09-08-2004, 06:28 AM
I'm tempted to split this off to noob, but I'll answer the question in hopes of heading off similiar me-too's


3.1u5 -> monte -> killinitrd OR killhdinitrd will get you into an 810 easily

all you really need to do is:

install monte or killhdinitrd (read!) put tivoftpd, ps and ls in /bin

copy /etc/netfilter-disable over /etc/netfilter-enable

setup the correct boot parms, rc.sysinit and rc.sysinit.author


if you understand what you're doing and have the files ready it'll take all of 5 mins to get networking going (doesn't take any longer to do a hr10-250)

everything else (noscramble, extraction, tivoweb, whatever) can be done via bash / telnet / ftp with the tivo running

AlphaWolf
09-18-2004, 11:41 PM
How do these tivos handle dvd recording of tystreams that aren't in a dvd compatible resolution? I am curious if they re-encode the video if it is recorded in something nonstandard, or better yet if they re-encode the video no matter what when copying it to dvd.

rc3105
09-19-2004, 03:27 AM
simple, they don't. even doing a hmo mrv transfer breaks legit streams such that they can't be burned

had some limited success getting the 810 to play hd streams, repair/conform to 810 burnable specs is on my todo list (need about a hundred gig of sample files from 3 or 4 alternate units to verify everything)

AlphaWolf
09-19-2004, 10:27 AM
simple, they don't. even doing a hmo mrv transfer breaks legit streams such that they can't be burned

had some limited success getting the 810 to play hd streams, repair/conform to 810 burnable specs is on my todo list (need about a hundred gig of sample files from 3 or 4 alternate units to verify everything)

So you can't change the recording resolution on the DVD units via tivoweb?

Well, in any case, you know what would be trick is to patch tivoapp to disable the video sanity checks, and make a software layer which fakes the existence of a dvd burner on the IDE channel and receives the mpeg-2 video data sent by tivoapp in verbatim and relays it over the network via netcat. Would make a nice way to instantly convert video to regular mpeg-2 on the fly, and with perfection too.

BTW, I wonder if the Pioneer DVR-108 (http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?submit=Go&DEPA=0&CMP=OTC-Froogle&description=N82E16827129156) would be compatible with whichever 5.x software that uses the Pioneer DVR-105? It's a pretty cheap DVD drive ($84,) and apparently it's very feature packed as well (includes 4x dual layer burning.)

rc3105
09-19-2004, 10:23 PM
dunno about changing the 810 recording resoution yet, haven't tried

did try A04 & A06, neither would take the 810 burner prom. don't have 5,7,8 to try

Trusted-1
09-26-2004, 12:10 PM
dunno about changing the 810 recording resoution yet, haven't tried

did try A04 & A06, neither would take the 810 burner prom. don't have 5,7,8 to try

I understand that the DVD resolution on the 57H was adjustable but on the 810 it was not.

We are testing an 810 for an install next week and it seems that if you record a source in the highest resolution you only seem to get one hour worth of material to fit on a DVD-R. Our guy checking the unit said that the 57H could change the resolution in the recording process to allow for two hours to fit.

Hope this helps.

Trusted-1

mrblack51
09-26-2004, 02:49 PM
I understand that the DVD resolution on the 57H was adjustable but on the 810 it was not.

We are testing an 810 for an install next week and it seems that if you record a source in the highest resolution you only seem to get one hour worth of material to fit on a DVD-R. Our guy checking the unit said that the 57H could change the resolution in the recording process to allow for two hours to fit.

Hope this helps.

Trusted-1

there are two types of "resolution changing" being talked about here. one is the ability to switch between "basic, medium, high, and best/extreme" quality settings. that is done in hte tivo menu system, and is available on all tivos (including the 810 and the 57h). as noted, there are no significant differences between the 57h and the 810, other than those mentioned in the first post of the thread.

the other type of resolution changing reffers to modifications to the mfs resources, often applied with the resources editor in tivoweb. these settings allow you to tweak the resoulution and bitrate of the individual quality settings. more specifically, the resource settings determine what "basic" recording quality means

Trusted-1
09-27-2004, 10:55 AM
Mrblack51,

Thanks for the update.

I was under the impression (perhaps incorrectly) that the 57H was able to adjust the DVD burning ratios but the 810H did not have this feature. My purpose was only to make anyone interested aware that there may have been a difference as most of the work seemed to focus on the 810H (which is at least closer to my personal budget) than the 57H.

I will continue to follow with interest.

Trusted-1

mrblack51
09-27-2004, 11:58 AM
Mrblack51,

Thanks for the update.

I was under the impression (perhaps incorrectly) that the 57H was able to adjust the DVD burning ratios but the 810H did not have this feature. My purpose was only to make anyone interested aware that there may have been a difference as most of the work seemed to focus on the 810H (which is at least closer to my personal budget) than the 57H.

I will continue to follow with interest.

Trusted-1

The 810H and the 57H are identical except for the things mentioned above. the minor differences are cosmetic for the most part, sans the larger hard drive. As such, working with either an 810H or a 57H is irrelevant. Recording quality can be set on any unit.

AlphaWolf
10-03-2004, 05:58 PM
Has anybody yet tried dumping the firmware from the pioneer dvr-105 included with the tivo and loading it to another pioneer burner similar to it? The possibility exists that it would work with the hardware revisions above 105.

AlphaWolf
10-04-2004, 04:01 PM
been there, done that. didn't have an A05, but tried A04, A06, A07

no joy

How did you dump the firmware from the 105?

alunj
10-19-2004, 05:02 PM
however, if you are outside north america, there is still the pal vs. ntsc issue to deal with.
It seems that Oztivo guys have made some progress with that.
I'm awaiting the arrival of the Humax S2/DVD unit, pics to follow.
Should be a bunch of fun persauding it to work in the UK :)

rc3105
10-20-2004, 12:38 AM
How did you dump the firmware from the 105?
it's in mfs, startup scripts even update the burner if needed

lsmod
11-02-2004, 06:23 PM
Riley,

I'm happily burning tyDVDs, from my S1 DTivos, but I'd swap out the S1's for HDVR2s if there was a path to use an 810 as the burner.

The PC based tools are great for me, but they're not wife-compatible. :)

Is being able to move streams from the HDVR2 to the 810 from within the TiVo UI (HMO?) and then burn them on your radar?

If so, I'll start surfing eBay for hardware.

jasch
11-02-2004, 07:10 PM
Is being able to move streams from the HDVR2 to the 810 from within the TiVo UI (HMO?) and then burn them on your radar?

There's some kind of flag on the streams that will not let any TIVO DVDR burn programs recorded on other units (only stuff recorded on the same unit).

That's why I haven't purchased one either...

lsmod
11-02-2004, 07:32 PM
There's some kind of flag on the streams that will not let any TIVO DVDR burn programs recorded on other units (only stuff recorded on the same unit).

That's why I haven't purchased one either...


Yes, I've read this thread. But Riley mentioned that he was working on convert/conform to burnable, and I was wondering if he was heading in this direction, or just being able to move from 810 to 810, or SA to 810.

And, though I'm no developer, I've done QA off and on for most of my career, and I'm quite comfortable in Linux, so at least I can test. :)

jasch
11-02-2004, 07:48 PM
Yes, I've read this thread. But Riley mentioned that he was working on convert/conform to burnable, and I was wondering if he was heading in this direction, or just being able to move from 810 to 810, or SA to 810.

Well, if that were the case, I would purchase one in a hearbet. Riley is a very talented programmer, and has very intricate knowledge of the TIVO OS and the streams. If someone can do it, it would be him...

I've already contributed for mfs_ftp and set_series in the past (from Riley), and right now I am on the bounty for HMO and LBA48 native support on RID units. If he were to make something that will let me transfer streams from my DTIVO to a 810 and burn them I would contribute too...

rc3105
11-06-2004, 02:46 AM
conforming s1 & s2 sa/dtivo/hdtivo recs into pioneer/toshiba/humax burnable streams is doable. just need the time & energy (both in short supply) to package up something usable

don't run out & buy a burner combo box just yet though, might wrap it up to use a usb attached burner on any old s2 or release it as a tivo specific xbox solution (been running that for a while actually, xbox + linux bios modchip + dvd burner is still cheaper & more flexible than a tivo burner combo)


edit: tivo just screwed my siblings out of ANOTHER $300 in rebates. not real inclined to evangelize the company / products at the moment

rc3105
01-06-2005, 01:30 PM
anybody tried reading + or +rw dvd's in an 810's DVR-105?

optodisk +rw ($22/100) read just fine on both 810's here, wondering if that's the norm or a fluke

alunj
01-10-2005, 02:09 AM
not that i have tried onthe tosh / pioneer but
the humax is ok with + ( i guess most ide dvd units are + and - these days)

A