Single Wire Multiswitch question

[BeagleBoy]

Can you use an HR10-250 (or a DVR2) with a SWM? Is there a dongle to split a single wire feed from a SWM into two?

-Jim

[nova1]

I believe all the various satellites are available at once on the single wire. A high frequency splitter should work to split the signal.

Does anyone know what sats are mapped to which frequencies on the SWM?
The HR10-250 and HDVR2 tuners can only tune into certain frequency ranges.

The SWM-5 may have a legacy port for use by the older tuners.

You should probably check with www.dbstalk.com for more info on SWMs.

[PlainBill]

Can you use an HR10-250 (or a DVR2) with a SWM?
Sure. Just hook the cable to the SAT1 input.
Is there a dongle to split a single wire feed from a SWM into two?

-Jim
No. If you want to use both tuners you must run two cables back to the multiswitch / dish.

PlainBill

[ronnythunder]

I believe all the various satellites are available at once on the single wire. A high frequency splitter should work to split the signal.

Does anyone know what sats are mapped to which frequencies on the SWM?
The HR10-250 and HDVR2 tuners can only tune into certain frequency ranges.

The SWM-5 may have a legacy port for use by the older tuners.

You should probably check with www.dbstalk.com for more info on SWMs.it's actually quite cool the way they work. this is the best way i've come up with to explain it:

before swm, various methods were used (voltage, tone etc.) by the receiver to "ask for" a specific transponder to be presented on the wire. all channels available on that transponder (as many as 8 or more iirc) were candidates for being shown on the ird.

with swm, the multiswitch receives "requests" from the irds saying "i need channel 215", "i need channel 204" etc. and the swm builds a "virtual" transponder with these channels mapped to it. a swm-8 would have up to eight channels mapped onto it.

this is also why splitters work; every ird contributes to the list of channels, and it's a custom mapping.

does that make it better or is it worse? i understand it in my head perfectly. :)

ronny

[BeagleBoy]

Sure. Just hook the cable to the SAT1 input.
So the SWM will recognize an older style transponder request, and act accordingly? So in the very off-chance that I managed to snag a single-wire, I'd still be able to plug in my tivos?

Ironically, the place that I will be putting an HR20/21 is the easiest place to run two cables to. :rolleyes:

But since it's unlikely that I can convince them to give me a "beta" SWM, this is probably all moot anyway.

-Jim

[jt1134]

I believe the SWM's have legacy ports specifically for older receivers. Getting one seems to be a crapshoot though. My friend who is an installer said he was told they would install them if it was the best choice for the customer's situation, but they don't even have them in stock yet and don't know when they'll get them.

[nova1]

it's actually quite cool the way they work. this is the best way i've come up with to explain it:

before swm, various methods were used (voltage, tone etc.) by the receiver to "ask for" a specific transponder to be presented on the wire. all channels available on that transponder (as many as 8 or more iirc) were candidates for being shown on the ird.

with swm, the multiswitch receives "requests" from the irds saying "i need channel 215", "i need channel 204" etc. and the swm builds a "virtual" transponder with these channels mapped to it. a swm-8 would have up to eight channels mapped onto it.

this is also why splitters work; every ird contributes to the list of channels, and it's a custom mapping.

does that make it better or is it worse? i understand it in my head perfectly. :)

ronny
Thanks for the info.

So the IRD still has to "ask for" a transponder from the SWM, the SWM then translates the real transponder frequency into one of the available "classes/channels/slots" on the single wire to present this virtual transponder.

Does anybody have any info on how the IRD talks with the SWM and what "classes(frequency ranges)" are used on the wire?

[ronnythunder]

Does anybody have any info on how the IRD talks with the SWM and what "classes(frequency ranges)" are used on the wire?i know there's info at dbstalk about the freq. ranges, but i don't recall seeing anything on the protocol. i gotta believe it's pretty primitive, as there's not really much that needs to happen in terms of communicating:

ird addr 1 -> swm: gimme channel 204
ird addr 2 -> swm: gimme channel 325
swm -> all: channel 204 starts at x mhz, channel 325 starts at y mhz

i admit it's a brilliant approach to the problem; seems that there probably would have been a big "ta-da" moment in some engineer's mind a few years ago to hatch this. :)

ronny

[PlainBill]

So the SWM will recognize an older style transponder request, and act accordingly? So in the very off-chance that I managed to snag a single-wire, I'd still be able to plug in my tivos?

Ironically, the place that I will be putting an HR20/21 is the easiest place to run two cables to. :rolleyes:

But since it's unlikely that I can convince them to give me a "beta" SWM, this is probably all moot anyway.

-Jim
According to the information on DBStalk, the SWM that was used for the 'cutting edge' testing had two legacy ports. These ports can be used with an older DirecTiVo. They also specifically stated that only the HR20 (and presumably the HR21) have the tuners and software to work with the 'SWM' port.

It appears the SWM is limited to supporting 8 tuners. Frankly, I see it as a niche product, useful only if running a second coax is impossible.

PlainBill

[BeagleBoy]

It appears the SWM is limited to supporting 8 tuners. Frankly, I see it as a niche product, useful only if running a second coax is impossible.
Well, I just moved into a nice two-story house, that has single-wire homeruns to most rooms. So while it's not impossible to run second lines, it's going to be painful and/or a bit pricey. A magical single-wire solution would be nice. ;)

On the bright side, they're swapping out my old samsung HD receiver for an HR20. Leaving me with a DVR80, an HR10-250, and an HR20. The funny thing is, they wouldn't move my samsung, since it was old HD tech, but they're happily moving my HR10 (with the same tech). I suppose the price-tag of the HR10 was high enough that they don't want to make people too mad by telling them they have to swap it out for a receiver that costs $700 less. :rolleyes:

-Jim

[PlainBill]

Well, I just moved into a nice two-story house, that has single-wire homeruns to most rooms. So while it's not impossible to run second lines, it's going to be painful and/or a bit pricey. A magical single-wire solution would be nice. ;)

-Jim

Depending on the construction, running coax in a two story house, even in an outside wall, can be fairly easy. (In others, it can be a royal bitch). Also, recently builders have been using 'structure cable' (contains 2 cat-5 and 2 RG-6 cables) from a panel in the laundry room (or other central location) to each room. In many cases they only terminate one of each cable. The other is left tucked inside the wall.

PlainBill

[stevel]

There are currently two variants of SWM modules, one with 5 channels and one with 9. The 5-channel model has, as mentioned earlier, two "legacy" ports which act like traditional lines to a standard multisat dish and will work with DTiVos. DTiVos will not understand a SWM line.

SWM is not yet "public" and I don't think you can get one by asking. I would love to have one as it would mean I could hook up my OTA antenna to one of the four lines I have running to my dish - I'd have two lines for the HR10 and one SWM line that feeds my HR20 and HR21.

[PlainBill]

There are currently two variants of SWM modules, one with 5 channels and one with 9. The 5-channel model has, as mentioned earlier, two "legacy" ports which act like traditional lines to a standard multisat dish and will work with DTiVos. DTiVos will not understand a SWM line.

SWM is not yet "public" and I don't think you can get one by asking. I would love to have one as it would mean I could hook up my OTA antenna to one of the four lines I have running to my dish - I'd have two lines for the HR10 and one SWM line that feeds my HR20 and HR21.

Any idea of the cost of a SWM? Want to bet it wouldn't be cheaper in most cases to run an extra coax?

Admittedly, my home is a little unusual. All signal distribution is handled from the closet in the spare bedroom. All cables from the dish and OTA antenna run to the closet. If I want to add another cable it's as simple as hooking the end to the twine I already have in place and pulling the new line (and a replacement twine) through. When I ran cables to the HDTV I ran two cables for satellite, 1 for OTA, Cat 5 for the network, Cat 3 for telephone, and a twine just in case I decide to add something.

PlainBill

[BeagleBoy]

Admittedly, my home is a little unusual. All signal distribution is handled from the closet in the spare bedroom. All cables from the dish and OTA antenna run to the closet. If I want to add another cable it's as simple as hooking the end to the twine I already have in place and pulling the new line (and a replacement twine) through.Yeah, given the choice, I'd have a similar setup. But the house was built 11 years ago. All the wiring is home-run to a room in the basement. No conduit. No nylon pulls. In fact, it's probably stapled in place.

I'm trying to avoid cables on the outside of the house, so I'm going to have to (hopefully) find a chase from the attic to the basement. If I can snake cable to the attic, I'm home free.

[slider565]

I'm trying to avoid cables on the outside of the house, so I'm going to have to (hopefully) find a chase from the attic to the basement. If I can snake cable to the attic, I'm home free.
My house was built 6 years ago, and there is a PVC pipe in the basement that goes up to the attic. It's there for radon abatement (you'd attach a fan system to it to suck the radon gas from under your foundation and shoot it out through the roof), but if you're radon levels are good you can use it as a conduit. Look for a pipe sticking out of the ceiling in the unfinished area of your basement (if you have an unfinished area).

[stevel]

I haven't a clue on cost. As for what's cheaper, that's sometimes not an option. I have four cables run to my dish and they go under the siding so it looks nice. If I had to run a fifth, it would be big trouble.

Now, I don't need a fifth unless I also want to use OTA along with the four satellite runs. But I do....

[PlainBill]

I haven't a clue on cost. As for what's cheaper, that's sometimes not an option. I have four cables run to my dish and they go under the siding so it looks nice. If I had to run a fifth, it would be big trouble.

Now, I don't need a fifth unless I also want to use OTA along with the four satellite runs. But I do....

That's not an insurmountable problem. Depending on the age, lifting siding, running the cable, then refastening the siding may be trivial. Also, a piece of PVC pipe painted to match the siding results in a 'better than professional' looking job. I could also show you work done by professionals that left the homeowner screaming in rage.

PlainBill

[labbie48]

If it's vinyl siding, it's pretty easy to lift. I have done it a few times to add an outlet or a light on the outside of my house. I took an old flat head screwdriver and bent the tip at a 45 degree angle to get under the lip and pop it. Works great and and popping it back is a no brainer. If it's old aluminum, you're SOL!

[labbie48]

Found a site selling SWM's for $50.00. They provide a tutorial for hooking it up.

My bad, thats what happens when you stay up too late.... This is for a diplexer, so I removed the link.

[ronnythunder]

that link is for a diplexer. i couldn't find any swms there.

ronny

[stevel]

I know it's not insurmountable - but it is more pain than I want to go through.

To the best of my knowledge, SWM is not released to the public yet and you can't buy them anywhere.